Surprise Visit

[Jess]

I have tried my best to stay under the radar and fade slowly until becoming completely inactive in recent weeks. And after recent revelations and discoveries, I have stopped attending meetings entirely and blocked some elders from contacting me. However, today I got a surprise visit from a Sister in my hall. A very very sweet sister who I had never met in person and she was coming to encourage me to come back in person to the Hall.

We stood in my driveway and talked for a good 25 min. I tried my best to beat around the bush at first but it got to a point where I needed to express why I wasn't coming to meetings anymore. I told her that "I had issues with the Higher Ups" and that things with them had changed A LOT since I first began studying 6 years ago. She asked me what I meant by Higher Ups. I mentioned the GB/Faithful and Discreet slave and that they were no longer "Discreet" anymore and that it bothered me. I also mentioned the whole reason this all started was due to the pushing of the vaccine and that I had nearly died from a vaccine years ago. She did not understand that at all. She said "I still don't understand. What is the issue with the GB and the vaccine then? You didn't have to take the COVID vaccine".

I mentioned the treatment of the brothers and sisters towards me during the pandemic etc. I told her I was also dealing with alot of family opposition since some things have come out about the Org lately. I said I still pray and read the Bible every day and am still very close in my relationship with Jehovah and Jesus but that I am just very weary of trusting in men and that Jesus warned us not to be deceived. I ended with saying I am just taking time out and I need space to figure some things out but that I still love all the Brothers and Sisters very much.

She seemed very confused (she has no idea about any of these big issues with the Org) and she just kept saying that "the Org never claimed to be perfect and that they are always coming out with New Light admitting their imperfections" and also that "Jehovah has always had an organization" etc.

I tried to be careful with my words to drop some truth about the situation and not completely scare her off or burst her bubble as I really do like her alot and her intentions are no doubt sincere and out of love.

Anyway, it was stressful and I wish I had left for the grocery store earlier than I did now lol because maybe I got myself into some trouble now 🤪

Her husband is an elder and no doubt this conversation will not stop with her. My question is do you think what I said is a disfellowshipping offense?

I don't particularly want to be disfellowshipped but if it happens for speaking truth, so be it. But also, can they disfellowship without a hearing?

 

[SusanB]

I have tried my best to stay under the radar and fade slowly until becoming completely inactive in recent weeks. And after recent revelations and discoveries, I have stopped attending meetings entirely and blocked some elders from contacting me. However, today I got a surprise visit from a Sister in my hall. A very very sweet sister who I had never met in person and she was coming to encourage me to come back in person to the Hall.

We stood in my driveway and talked for a good 25 min. I tried my best to beat around the bush at first but it got to a point where I needed to express why I wasn't coming to meetings anymore. I told her that "I had issues with the Higher Ups" and that things with them had changed A LOT since I first began studying 6 years ago. She asked me what I meant by Higher Ups. I mentioned the GB/Faithful and Discreet slave and that they were no longer "Discreet" anymore and that it bothered me. I also mentioned the whole reason this all started was due to the pushing of the vaccine and that I had nearly died from a vaccine years ago. She did not understand that at all. She said "I still don't understand. What is the issue with the GB and the vaccine then? You didn't have to take the COVID vaccine".

I mentioned the treatment of the brothers and sisters towards me during the pandemic etc. I told her I was also dealing with alot of family opposition since some things have come out about the Org lately. I said I still pray and read the Bible every day and am still very close in my relationship with Jehovah and Jesus but that I am just very weary of trusting in men and that Jesus warned us not to be deceived. I ended with saying I am just taking time out and I need space to figure some things out but that I still love all the Brothers and Sisters very much.

She seemed very confused (she has no idea about any of these big issues with the Org) and she just kept saying that "the Org never claimed to be perfect and that they are always coming out with New Light admitting their imperfections" and also that "Jehovah has always had an organization" etc.

I tried to be careful with my words to drop some truth about the situation and not completely scare her off or burst her bubble as I really do like her alot and her intentions are no doubt sincere and out of love.

Anyway, it was stressful and I wish I had left for the grocery store earlier than I did now lol because maybe I got myself into some trouble now 🤪

Her husband is an elder and no doubt this conversation will not stop with her. My question is do you think what I said is a disfellowshipping offense?

I don't particularly want to be disfellowshipped but if it happens for speaking truth, so be it. But also, can they disfellowship without a hearing?

I don’t think they will DF you without a hearing and I don’t think you said anything that would cause them to even consider DF’g you. Good for you for being honest. We should speak truth with one another and although I’m guessing it felt uncomfortable while you were in the conversation, you no doubt feel more free and peace of mind by being clear with your thoughts. It is love in action to be kind and yet truthful with everyone.

Ephesians 4:25: “Therefore, now that you have put away deceit, each one of you speak truth with his neighbor, because we are members belonging to one another.“

Ephesians 4:15: “But speaking the truth, let us by love grow up in all things into him who is the head, Christ.“

 

[goldie]

I have tried my best to stay under the radar and fade slowly until becoming completely inactive in recent weeks. And after recent revelations and discoveries, I have stopped attending meetings entirely and blocked some elders from contacting me. However, today I got a surprise visit from a Sister in my hall. A very very sweet sister who I had never met in person and she was coming to encourage me to come back in person to the Hall.

We stood in my driveway and talked for a good 25 min. I tried my best to beat around the bush at first but it got to a point where I needed to express why I wasn't coming to meetings anymore. I told her that "I had issues with the Higher Ups" and that things with them had changed A LOT since I first began studying 6 years ago. She asked me what I meant by Higher Ups. I mentioned the GB/Faithful and Discreet slave and that they were no longer "Discreet" anymore and that it bothered me. I also mentioned the whole reason this all started was due to the pushing of the vaccine and that I had nearly died from a vaccine years ago. She did not understand that at all. She said "I still don't understand. What is the issue with the GB and the vaccine then? You didn't have to take the COVID vaccine".

I mentioned the treatment of the brothers and sisters towards me during the pandemic etc. I told her I was also dealing with alot of family opposition since some things have come out about the Org lately. I said I still pray and read the Bible every day and am still very close in my relationship with Jehovah and Jesus but that I am just very weary of trusting in men and that Jesus warned us not to be deceived. I ended with saying I am just taking time out and I need space to figure some things out but that I still love all the Brothers and Sisters very much.

She seemed very confused (she has no idea about any of these big issues with the Org) and she just kept saying that "the Org never claimed to be perfect and that they are always coming out with New Light admitting their imperfections" and also that "Jehovah has always had an organization" etc.

I tried to be careful with my words to drop some truth about the situation and not completely scare her off or burst her bubble as I really do like her alot and her intentions are no doubt sincere and out of love.

Anyway, it was stressful and I wish I had left for the grocery store earlier than I did now lol because maybe I got myself into some trouble now 🤪

Her husband is an elder and no doubt this conversation will not stop with her. My question is do you think what I said is a disfellowshipping offense?

I don't particularly want to be disfellowshipped but if it happens for speaking truth, so be it. But also, can they disfellowship without a hearing?

Be proud of yourself, sounds like you handled the situation very well. You said nothing to get yourself disfellowshipped, you just voiced your concerns about what you see going on. Good for you! I applaud you.

 

[Jess]

I don’t think they will DF you without a hearing and I don’t think you said anything that would cause them to even consider DF’g you. Good for you for being honest. We should speak truth with one another and although I’m guessing it felt uncomfortable while you were in the conversation, you no doubt feel more free and peace of mind by being clear with your thoughts. It is love in action to be kind and yet truthful with everyone.

Ephesians 4:25: “Therefore, now that you have put away deceit, each one of you speak truth with his neighbor, because we are members belonging to one another.“

Ephesians 4:15: “But speaking the truth, let us by love grow up in all things into him who is the head, Christ.“

Thanks Driven, you have been a wonderful example when it comes to taking a stand courageously. It needed to be said and I danced around it long enough with the elders. Now they will know at least and I'm not gonna worry about it anymore. And those are wonderful scriptures to meditate on for sure

 

[Ms_ladyblue]

I have tried my best to stay under the radar and fade slowly until becoming completely inactive in recent weeks. And after recent revelations and discoveries, I have stopped attending meetings entirely and blocked some elders from contacting me. However, today I got a surprise visit from a Sister in my hall. A very very sweet sister who I had never met in person and she was coming to encourage me to come back in person to the Hall.

We stood in my driveway and talked for a good 25 min. I tried my best to beat around the bush at first but it got to a point where I needed to express why I wasn't coming to meetings anymore. I told her that "I had issues with the Higher Ups" and that things with them had changed A LOT since I first began studying 6 years ago. She asked me what I meant by Higher Ups. I mentioned the GB/Faithful and Discreet slave and that they were no longer "Discreet" anymore and that it bothered me. I also mentioned the whole reason this all started was due to the pushing of the vaccine and that I had nearly died from a vaccine years ago. She did not understand that at all. She said "I still don't understand. What is the issue with the GB and the vaccine then? You didn't have to take the COVID vaccine".

I mentioned the treatment of the brothers and sisters towards me during the pandemic etc. I told her I was also dealing with alot of family opposition since some things have come out about the Org lately. I said I still pray and read the Bible every day and am still very close in my relationship with Jehovah and Jesus but that I am just very weary of trusting in men and that Jesus warned us not to be deceived. I ended with saying I am just taking time out and I need space to figure some things out but that I still love all the Brothers and Sisters very much.

She seemed very confused (she has no idea about any of these big issues with the Org) and she just kept saying that "the Org never claimed to be perfect and that they are always coming out with New Light admitting their imperfections" and also that "Jehovah has always had an organization" etc.

I tried to be careful with my words to drop some truth about the situation and not completely scare her off or burst her bubble as I really do like her alot and her intentions are no doubt sincere and out of love.

Anyway, it was stressful and I wish I had left for the grocery store earlier than I did now lol because maybe I got myself into some trouble now 🤪

Her husband is an elder and no doubt this conversation will not stop with her. My question is do you think what I said is a disfellowshipping offense?

I don't particularly want to be disfellowshipped but if it happens for speaking truth, so be it. But also, can they disfellowship without a hearing?

@Jess It seems very strange that whenever you try to talk to the witnesses about the organization they all have the same response.
Today, I happened to talk to a brother, we’ve known him and his family for years…since before we were witnesses. Even though he knows how involved we were in organizational activities. I explained to him much the same as what you tried talking to the sister about. But it‘s like they don’t get the sense of what you’re saying.

They always end up asking: ‘have you found something better? Or where else are you going to go?‘
I said JESUS! That’s who we listen to and follow… I asked him: “where in the Bible does it say that Jehovah uses an organization to represent him? The Bible says do not put your trust in men.”

Everything I mentioned pertaining to what I learned about the organization he either wouldn’t believe it or he’d say “well, they’re imperfect men.“ Unbelievable! 🙄

I talked so much about what I’ve learned about the organization. I’m sure you were probably better than me about staying calm. I get so excited and my voice gradually got a little louder. But he knows how I am too. (also he use to be an elder) I also told him that I wasn’t worried if he told the elders. At this point I’m not worried anymore. He said he’s not telling them anything. But I better be careful who I’m listening to because it might cause me to become agnostic.
He thinks that one day he’ll be able to tell me “I told you so.” Like as if everything they’ve done will be proved wrong.
I just told him…”well, we’ll see about that.”

I’m sure I could talk to him a little more freely than you felt you could talk to the sister because…well, you have to know this brother to understand. In fact the conversation ended fine. He was just being a hard nose…I guess that’s like saying a ‘hard shell baptist.’ 😊

Jess, you handled the situation with the sister very well. But I can very much relate how you felt too. ☺️

 

[BagdadBill]

Anyone who says that the GB are not or did not exert downward pressure or instigate peer pressure to take the injections and play along with the scam, are in denial or outright liars at this point. At some point some have to make decisions in their life that may seem undesirable and possibly extreme at the time. This is what is is coming down to is a sifting. I have finally realized that I will never be able to associate with Jehovah's Witnesses as a group or religion ever again. They have all made decisions at their various levels to accept what is happening right now and that something is deadly. It doesn't take much observance to notice the trend in the articles and postings on the official site as they gravitate toward the same verbiage and statements that the UN, WHO and WEF are making.
If you speak the same language then stay with your own kind. I am not of their sort any longer. I cannot play along with such obvious lies.

 

[Nomex]

My question is do you think what I said is a disfellowshipping offense?

I don't particularly want to be disfellowshipped but if it happens for speaking truth, so be it. But also, can they disfellowship without a hearing?

First of all, one thing to keep in mind, this is why they always meet with you with two brothers. The two Witness rule. I don't make it a habit to encourage anyone to deny something they said, but that's an option if the elders did want to push this. And by deny I mean, you can just not tell them anything. What ever they say this sister said to them is hearsay. You can 100% deny whatever she says you said that her memory got wrong , and of course you can say, "I'm not sure i said that", if they push something that they would try to use to DF you. What they will be looking for is anything they can use to accuse you of sowing disunity... so the less you say to any 2 elders the better. And of course the best ever option, do not agree to meet with them EVER about anything!


Having said all that, I'm not sure what I'd do if I have to face off with them. I already got the request to turn in my time. I reported 40 hours last month and I'm not even going to meetings, maybe I'll report 400 this month. I'm wondering what it will take for it to get a red flag...if they finally say something I'll just say, one of the numbers on my keyboard doesn't work right. Which is completely true. But it's not the "0"...LOL. I'll leave that part out. Oh wait, I used my phone...I guess I'll have to think of something else....ROFLOL!

 

[Ms_ladyblue]

Having said all that, I'm not sure what I'd do if I have to face off with them. I already got the request to turn in my time. I reported 40 hours last month and I'm not even going to meetings, maybe I'll report 400 this month. I'm wondering what it will take for it to get a red flag...if they finally say something I'll just say, one of the numbers on my keyboard doesn't work right. Which is completely true. But it's not the "0"...LOL. I'll leave that part out. Oh wait, I used my phone...I guess I'll have to think of something else....ROFLOL!

My thoughts exactly @Nomex….lol 😅

 

[Watchman]

She seemed very confused (she has no idea about any of these big issues with the Org) and she just kept saying that "the Org never claimed to be perfect and that they are always coming out with New Light admitting their imperfections" and also that "Jehovah has always had an organization" etc.

She really is confused. The org has never admitted to any sort of error. Whenever they come out with "new light" there is never any sort of acknowledgment that they were wrong. But it is true that Jehovah has always had an organization. And it is also true that he has always destroyed them when he was done with them.

But no, Jess, they will not disfellowship you without a hearing. Especially since there is no valid reason. It is not like you are opening practicing some notorious sinful lifestyle. Saying you do not trust men, no matter how faithful and discreet they claim to be, is completely understandable and scriptural.

 

[Charming Primrose]

I have tried my best to stay under the radar and fade slowly until becoming completely inactive in recent weeks. And after recent revelations and discoveries, I have stopped attending meetings entirely and blocked some elders from contacting me. However, today I got a surprise visit from a Sister in my hall. A very very sweet sister who I had never met in person and she was coming to encourage me to come back in person to the Hall.

We stood in my driveway and talked for a good 25 min. I tried my best to beat around the bush at first but it got to a point where I needed to express why I wasn't coming to meetings anymore. I told her that "I had issues with the Higher Ups" and that things with them had changed A LOT since I first began studying 6 years ago. She asked me what I meant by Higher Ups. I mentioned the GB/Faithful and Discreet slave and that they were no longer "Discreet" anymore and that it bothered me. I also mentioned the whole reason this all started was due to the pushing of the vaccine and that I had nearly died from a vaccine years ago. She did not understand that at all. She said "I still don't understand. What is the issue with the GB and the vaccine then? You didn't have to take the COVID vaccine".

I mentioned the treatment of the brothers and sisters towards me during the pandemic etc. I told her I was also dealing with alot of family opposition since some things have come out about the Org lately. I said I still pray and read the Bible every day and am still very close in my relationship with Jehovah and Jesus but that I am just very weary of trusting in men and that Jesus warned us not to be deceived. I ended with saying I am just taking time out and I need space to figure some things out but that I still love all the Brothers and Sisters very much.

She seemed very confused (she has no idea about any of these big issues with the Org) and she just kept saying that "the Org never claimed to be perfect and that they are always coming out with New Light admitting their imperfections" and also that "Jehovah has always had an organization" etc.

I tried to be careful with my words to drop some truth about the situation and not completely scare her off or burst her bubble as I really do like her alot and her intentions are no doubt sincere and out of love.

Anyway, it was stressful and I wish I had left for the grocery store earlier than I did now lol because maybe I got myself into some trouble now 🤪

Her husband is an elder and no doubt this conversation will not stop with her. My question is do you think what I said is a disfellowshipping offense?

I don't particularly want to be disfellowshipped but if it happens for speaking truth, so be it. But also, can they disfellowship without a hearing?

I honestly don’t think you will be df. I’m still amazed at how many JW’s have no clue as to what is happening today.
I have let the brothers know that I have DA myself from the org. & I have had verbal/email conversations with the elders as too my feelings & where I stand on all of this. I must not be DF as of yet because I’m still receiving weekly cong. meeting info & cong. updates & so on.
My last reply back from the elders of course was defending the org. Soooo, I know there is no changing their minds or even getting them to understand how I’m feeling or what I’m saying. So I’ve just left it at that. Have t replied back to their email.

 

[Charming Primrose]

Anyone who says that the GB are not or did not exert downward pressure or instigate peer pressure to take the injections and play along with the scam, are in denial or outright liars at this point. At some point some have to make decisions in their life that may seem undesirable and possibly extreme at the time. This is what is is coming down to is a sifting. I have finally realized that I will never be able to associate with Jehovah's Witnesses as a group or religion ever again. They have all made decisions at their various levels to accept what is happening right now and that something is deadly. It doesn't take much observance to notice the trend in the articles and postings on the official site as they gravitate toward the same verbiage and statements that the UN, WHO and WEF are making.
If you speak the same language then stay with your own kind. I am not of their sort any longer. I cannot play along with such obvious lies.

Exactly. I no longer refer to myself as a JW. Being referred to as a JW makes you a representative of the organization in my opinion. So many people don’t even know Gods name. At this point if I’m to be given a label I am a follower of Christ, Christian, Truth Seeker.

 

[Watchman]

I honestly don’t think you will be df. I’m still amazed at how many JW’s have no clue as to what is happening today.
I have let the brothers know that I have DA myself from the org. & I have had verbal/email conversations with the elders as too my feelings & where I stand on all of this. I must not be DF as of yet because I’m still receiving weekly cong. meeting info & cong. updates & so on.
My last reply back from the elders of course was defending the org. Soooo, I know there is no changing their minds or even getting them to understand how I’m feeling or what I’m saying. So I’ve just left it at that. Have t replied back to their email.

If you have disassociated yourself your relationship with JW's is the same as a disfellowshipped person. Maybe your elders didn't get the memo.

 

[LifeLearning]

I honestly don’t think you will be df. I’m still amazed at how many JW’s have no clue as to what is happening today.
I have let the brothers know that I have DA myself from the org. & I have had verbal/email conversations with the elders as too my feelings & where I stand on all of this. I must not be DF as of yet because I’m still receiving weekly cong. meeting info & cong. updates & so on.
My last reply back from the elders of course was defending the org. Soooo, I know there is no changing their minds or even getting them to understand how I’m feeling or what I’m saying. So I’ve just left it at that. Have t replied back to their email.

I am sure the watchtower are dealing with huge numbers of people telling them the same thing you are. Reminds me of 'not knowing the way out'. There are going to be hundreds of thousands fading. Every time the leadership take action to bring back the fading they get blasted with truth. It must be hard to be an elder dealing with this, or even another brother or sister asked to go talk to the fading. The only reason they can continue is their 'echo chamber' reassuring each other that they are the righteous ones and those outside are apostate and dangerous.

Every day I think of Jesus telling the scribes and pharisees that a wicked generation seeks a sign and that no sign will be given except the sign of Jonah. It took being trapped facing certain death for Jonah to repent. And the people of Nineveh took the right action when he finally delivered the message he was sent to tell.

 

[Ms_ladyblue]

Exactly. I no longer refer to myself as a JW. Being referred to as a JW makes you a representative of the organization in my opinion. So many people don’t even know Gods name. At this point if I’m to be given a label I am a follower of Christ, Christian, Truth Seeker.

Rather than calling them Jehovah’s witnesses they should rightly be called, ‘Watchtower witnesses.’

 

[LifeLearning]

The org has never admitted to any sort of error.

This is interesting. Individual JW's have informally admitted the error of the 'adjustment' in 1977?(70's)... admitted to me personally, but nothing from the leadership. It must be the effect of double-speak by the leadership, such that publishers know the error and apologize for it, just not in writing, and not with explicit authority to do so.

Were the ones who did this going against the WT teaching?

 

[BARNABY THE DOG.]

I have tried my best to stay under the radar and fade slowly until becoming completely inactive in recent weeks. And after recent revelations and discoveries, I have stopped attending meetings entirely and blocked some elders from contacting me. However, today I got a surprise visit from a Sister in my hall. A very very sweet sister who I had never met in person and she was coming to encourage me to come back in person to the Hall.

We stood in my driveway and talked for a good 25 min. I tried my best to beat around the bush at first but it got to a point where I needed to express why I wasn't coming to meetings anymore. I told her that "I had issues with the Higher Ups" and that things with them had changed A LOT since I first began studying 6 years ago. She asked me what I meant by Higher Ups. I mentioned the GB/Faithful and Discreet slave and that they were no longer "Discreet" anymore and that it bothered me. I also mentioned the whole reason this all started was due to the pushing of the vaccine and that I had nearly died from a vaccine years ago. She did not understand that at all. She said "I still don't understand. What is the issue with the GB and the vaccine then? You didn't have to take the COVID vaccine".

I mentioned the treatment of the brothers and sisters towards me during the pandemic etc. I told her I was also dealing with alot of family opposition since some things have come out about the Org lately. I said I still pray and read the Bible every day and am still very close in my relationship with Jehovah and Jesus but that I am just very weary of trusting in men and that Jesus warned us not to be deceived. I ended with saying I am just taking time out and I need space to figure some things out but that I still love all the Brothers and Sisters very much.

She seemed very confused (she has no idea about any of these big issues with the Org) and she just kept saying that "the Org never claimed to be perfect and that they are always coming out with New Light admitting their imperfections" and also that "Jehovah has always had an organization" etc.

I tried to be careful with my words to drop some truth about the situation and not completely scare her off or burst her bubble as I really do like her alot and her intentions are no doubt sincere and out of love.

Anyway, it was stressful and I wish I had left for the grocery store earlier than I did now lol because maybe I got myself into some trouble now 🤪

Her husband is an elder and no doubt this conversation will not stop with her. My question is do you think what I said is a disfellowshipping offense?

I don't particularly want to be disfellowshipped but if it happens for speaking truth, so be it. But also, can they disfellowship without a hearing?

It is a shame that you have been put under pressure at a time when you are feeling vulnerable Jess. What you are fearing is common to us all in that change is unsettling. Your beliefs are being brought into question by them and there is a feeling of need to explain yourself, There is also, along with it, the sense of accusation, feeling at fault and being “in the wrong”. There is a good reason why you are made to feel that way, and it is solely because it is part of the watchtower methodology of preaching and teaching. This is a propaganda of watchtower overlaying the normal desire of people to ‘fit in’ within the norm of society in general and brings with it, the additional ’suspicion’ of “apostasy”. One does not need to have done any single thing wrong, to bring the charge of apostasy down upon themselves insofar as the congregation is concerned. Just not showing up at the hall is enough to be termed as weak, and attempt to explain, true or not, will simply confirm the suspicion.

Being here for a few years, reading what brothers and sisters have written, it appears that all have had to endure what you are going through. One cannot reason with others in the watchtower unless they themselves are waking. If they are not, then you are just a person with “apostate” ideas, listening To others.

From what I read here, apostasy to the bible has long since ceased to be an issue with watchtower. It is now apostasy from the watchtower that is to be feared. To disagree with them is apostasy. One can draw what they like from the bible, as long as they do not disagree openly with watchtower. Essentially then, what you voiced when you said “Do you think anything I have said is a disfellowshipping offence“, the answer is simply no, both from a truthful and biblical sense. It may well be seen as such by the watchtower though, but that does not matter in that it will come to all of us to declare our disgust with them and leave. It is only difficult for sisters and brothers now because we are the first to speak up and be reviled. When they all do it, they will be greeting each other as having seen the light.

For your own peace of mind Jess, please do not feel afraid of the changes of thought and spirituality that you are experiencing now. No one here will criticise you and certainly, Jehovah will support you and He is the one you can rely on. Do not let elders bully you or concede to meetings that you do not want to attend, but if you do need to speak with them, take a friend with you, or see them at your home and have a friend with you there. They have no ’rights ’ over you at all, or the format of the meeting. So set your own path with Jehovah and let prayer be your guide. Get Robert or Nomex to fly over and lend a hand. If Jehovah is with you, who can stand against you? Knock, and the door will be opened. Seek, and you shall find.

 

[Jess]

@Jess It seems very strange that whenever you try to talk to the witnesses about the organization they all have the same response.
Today, I happened to talk to a brother, we’ve known him and his family for years…since before we were witnesses. Even though he knows how involved we were in organizational activities. I explained to him much the same as what you tried talking to the sister about. But it‘s like they don’t get the sense of what you’re saying.

They always end up asking: ‘have you found something better? Or where else are you going to go?‘
I said JESUS! That’s who we listen to and follow… I asked him: “where in the Bible does it say that Jehovah uses an organization to represent him? The Bible says do not put your trust in men.”

Everything I mentioned pertaining to what I learned about the organization he either wouldn’t believe it or he’d say “well, they’re imperfect men.“ Unbelievable! 🙄

I talked so much about what I’ve learned about the organization. I’m sure you were probably better than me about staying calm. I get so excited and my voice gradually got a little louder. But he knows how I am too. (also he use to be an elder) I also told him that I wasn’t worried if he told the elders. At this point I’m not worried anymore. He said he’s not telling them anything. But I better be careful who I’m listening to because it might cause me to become agnostic.
He thinks that one day he’ll be able to tell me “I told you so.” Like as if everything they’ve done will be proved wrong.
I just told him…”well, we’ll see about that.”

I’m sure I could talk to him a little more freely than you felt you could talk to the sister because…well, you have to know this brother to understand. In fact the conversation ended fine. He was just being a hard nose…I guess that’s like saying a ‘hard shell baptist.’ 😊

Jess, you handled the situation with the sister very well. But I can very much relate how you felt too. ☺️

Thank you @Ms_ladyblue and exactly! Its almost liked they are trained to handle these conversations with talking points. Oh wait...🤔

 

[Jess]

For your own peace of mind Jess, please do not feel afraid of the changes of thought and spirituality that you are experiencing now. No one here will criticise you and certainly, Jehovah will support you and He is the one you can rely on. Do not let elders bully you or concede to meetings that you do not want to attend, but if you do need to speak with them, take a friend with you, or see them at your home and have a friend with you there. They have no ’rights ’ over you at all, or the format of the meeting. So set your own path with Jehovah and let prayer be your guide. Get Robert or Nomex to fly over and lend a hand. If Jehovah is with you, who can stand against you? Knock, and the door will be opened. Seek, and you shall find.

Awww thank BTB! And love this point above! And lol about Nomex and Robert flying here With prayer and everyone's help..I am letting go of the fear of disfellowshipping and fear of man. Pslam 118:6💜

 

[Jess]

She really is confused. The org has never admitted to any sort of error. Whenever they come out with "new light" there is never any sort of acknowledgment that they were wrong. But it is true that Jehovah has always had an organization. And it is also true that he has always destroyed them when he was done with them.

But no, Jess, they will not disfellowship you without a hearing. Especially since there is no valid reason. It is not like you are opening practicing some notorious sinful lifestyle. Saying you do not trust men, no matter how faithful and discreet they claim to be, is completely understandable and scriptural.

Yes my thoughts as well. Thanks Robert!

 

[Jess]

First of all, one thing to keep in mind, this is why they always meet with you with two brothers. The two Witness rule. I don't make it a habit to encourage anyone to deny something they said, but that's an option if the elders did want to push this. And by deny I mean, you can just not tell them anything. What ever they say this sister said to them is hearsay. You can 100% deny whatever she says you said that her memory got wrong , and of course you can say, "I'm not sure i said that", if they push something that they would try to use to DF you. What they will be looking for is anything they can use to accuse you of sowing disunity... so the less you say to any 2 elders the better. And of course the best ever option, do not agree to meet with them EVER about anything!


Having said all that, I'm not sure what I'd do if I have to face off with them. I already got the request to turn in my time. I reported 40 hours last month and I'm not even going to meetings, maybe I'll report 400 this month. I'm wondering what it will take for it to get a red flag...if they finally say something I'll just say, one of the numbers on my keyboard doesn't work right. Which is completely true. But it's not the "0"...LOL. I'll leave that part out. Oh wait, I used my phone...I guess I'll have to think of something else....ROFLOL!

Good points No mex! Go for the 400, "Apostate" Pioneer of the year