All things Mud

I've heard Tartaria mentioned on the forum a few times here so I thought it good since I know little beside the general gist to provide brothers and sisters that know more a thread to share data. I found this YouTube channel very interesting a few days ago mudfossil university it's entertaining and easy to binge.

 
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PJ54

Well-known member
Anyone up to speculating on the entity behind Poseidon? I'm asking because of the possible connection of the ten kings in revelation with the sons of poseidon in the atlantis myth. In canaanite mythology the counterparts of Zeus Poseidon and Hades are Baal, Yam and Mot we know zeus/baal is Satan and in the canaanite myth Baal allegedly fought and defeated Yam and Baal who were "beloved of El" so it wouldn't make sense to identify the devil as the entity that might be the father of the ten kings in revelation. scholars can discern that in the hebrew there would have been references to Yam that are lost in translation to the greek.
I wouldn't know honestly. Howbeit, there tends to be overlap in the myths & legends of old. Therefore, there could be a connection.
 

The God Pill

Well-known member
I wouldn't know honestly. Howbeit, there tends to be overlap in the myths & legends of old. Therefore, there could be a connection.
I honestly was thinking of asking you about twenty seconds before your post. Idk yet but seeking clarity on anywhere its relevant besides Yam there's also Mot/Mavet as the fourth horseman, Apollo and the messenger of the Tehom/Abzu maybe something to do with hermes equivalent
 
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PJ54

Well-known member
I honestly was thinking of asking you about twenty seconds before your post. I'd yet but seeking clarity on anywhere its relevant besides Yam there's also Mot/Mavet as the fourth horseman, Apollo and the messenger of the Tehom/Abzu maybe something to do with hermes equivalent
There are so many "deities" in the spirit realm that it would be tricky to pin point who is doing what without dabbling into the occult & traveling into the spirit realm using your mind. However, that's like being a sardine around a bunch of tuna & swordfish.
 

The God Pill

Well-known member
There are so many "deities" in the spirit realm that it would be tricky to pin point who is doing what without dabbling into the occult & traveling into the spirit realm using your mind. However, that's like being a sardine around a bunch of tuna & swordfish.
I follow, and it's good to be balanced give proper attention to our father's side. It's a project but not a lot of urgency more like the next step in preparing for what might unfold after familiarizing wirh anything from 2 Esdras and 2 Baruch Rev overlapping that may or may not come to pass. In any case all of Christ enemies will be defeated in time in any case. Given I've only put a few hours into tartaria research over the years any data on its significance would certainly be welcome.
 
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PJ54

Well-known member
I follow, and it's good to be balanced give proper attention to our father's side. It's a project but not a lot of urgency more like the next step in preparing for what might unfold after familiarizing wirth anything from 2 Esdras and 2 Baruch Rev overlapping that may or may not come to pass. In any case all of Christ enemies will be defeated in time in any case. Given I've only put a few hours into tartaria research over the years any data on its significance would certainly be welcome.
I found a couple of profiles on twitter that delve into the history of Tartaria. Might be worth checking out.
 

Cristo

Well-known member
Hey GP, I'm just curious as to the 'possible connection' part of your question. I'm deep into this rabbit hole in the other thread on the mark of the beast, trying to dig out in the next part, but I'm always interested in hearing differing perspectives. I'm not sure how the ten kings could possibly have a connection with the sons of Poseidon, as greek mythology and the Bible are completely separate from one another. One is myth, and the other is truth. To equate the two would be tantamount to saying that because Poseidon is the god of earthquakes, when Jesus said that there would be 'earthquakes in one place after another' there is a 'possible connection' between the two. However, as you may already know, speculation is a little hobby of mine I quite often find myself doing just that. What is your 'possible connection'?
Anyone up to speculating on the entity behind Poseidon? I'm asking because of the possible connection of the ten kings in revelation with the sons of poseidon in the atlantis myth. In canaanite mythology the counterparts of Zeus Poseidon and Hades are Baal, Yam and Mot we know zeus/baal is Satan and in the canaanite myth Baal allegedly fought and defeated Yam and Baal who were "beloved of El" so it wouldn't make sense to identify the devil as the entity that might be the father of the ten kings in revelation. scholars can discern that in the hebrew there would have been references to Yam that are lost in translation to the greek.
 

The God Pill

Well-known member
Hey GP, I'm just curious as to the 'possible connection' part of your question. I'm deep into this rabbit hole in the other thread on the mark of the beast, trying to dig out in the next part, but I'm always interested in hearing differing perspectives. I'm not sure how the ten kings could possibly have a connection with the sons of Poseidon, as greek mythology and the Bible are completely separate from one another. One is myth, and the other is truth. To equate the two would be tantamount to saying that because Poseidon is the god of earthquakes, when Jesus said that there would be 'earthquakes in one place after another' there is a 'possible connection' between the two. However, as you may already know, speculation is a little hobby of mine I quite often find myself doing just that. What is your 'possible connection'?
That's a bit of a disingenuous exaggeration but I don't mind. Pretty straightforward greek mythology is derivative of canaanite and mesopotamian that comes from the hurrians which's religion was of course rooted in a perverted view of the antedeluvian civilization therefore there is a connection to the culture and religion of Israel's enemies throughout the old testament and the Greek pantheon. Given that Poseidon = Yam and given in the myth of atlantis it was ruled by ten kings five pairs of twin sons of poseidon while it is far from a smoking gun it is fairly plausible the ten kings of revelation are connected in some fashion.

Haven't checked the septuagint of job to compare but in the masoretic there's literally a verse where the firstborn of mavet/mot/hades is mentioned. Recognizing the bibles acknowledgment of evil beings behind the pagan religions isn't subscribing to said religions. Chemosh (equivalent of ares the moabites started worshipping) is obviously a real being in the OT and enemy of the elohim of Israel.
 
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The God Pill

Well-known member
One could say the ten kings corresponds to the ten horns governments derrivative or rome etc of Daniel's fourth beast but as far as i can tell there is nothing described in Revelation that would correspond to the 3 horns getting plucked out. The only real alternative to atlantis angle is prior to the wild beast ruling the world the world is divided up exactly according to the club of rome model wth ten monarchial or close enough rulers over each zone
 
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Cristo

Well-known member
it is fairly plausible the ten kings of revelation are connected in some fashion.
Can you define 'fairly plausible' for me please, because I'm really not seeing a connection between mankinds creative interpretation of gods rooted in a satanic web of deceit, and a prophetic interpretation from Jehovah of ACTUAL events that occurs thousands of years later. IF, and I say that lightly, IF there is any connection between the two this would of course mean that Satan had foreknowledge of what would be written within the scriptures, even prior to Daniels vision of the ten horns/ten kings, and influenced mankinds imagination to preconceive a story that would align with the prophecy given by Jehovah. Do you actually think that is possible?

My comment above may come across as harsh, or possibly in an angry undertone, but please don't read it that way. I am truly trying to identify your connection between the two, but I'm just not seeing it yet, if there is something.
 

The God Pill

Well-known member
Can you define 'fairly plausible' for me please, because I'm really not seeing a connection between mankinds creative interpretation of gods rooted in a satanic web of deceit, and a prophetic interpretation from Jehovah of ACTUAL events that occurs thousands of years later. IF, and I say that lightly, IF there is any connection between the two this would of course mean that Satan had foreknowledge of what would be written within the scriptures, even prior to Daniels vision of the ten horns/ten kings, and influenced mankinds imagination to preconceive a story that would align with the prophecy given by Jehovah. Do you actually think that is possible?

My comment above may come across as harsh, or possibly in an angry undertone, but please don't read it that way. I am truly trying to identify your connection between the two, but I'm just not seeing it yet, if there is something.
I don't mind your replies you are fine it's just you seem to read a heck of a lot into what I write. There is a lot of polemical interaction between Jehovah's camp and the enemies take Jesus walking on water or coming with the cloud of glory among other things that's mocking Baal the "cloud rider" I don't have the image at the moment but archeologist have found a large carving of Baal walking on water.

By the way Proverbs references a comparable work by a Pharoah as well as it's structure that doesn't have anything to do with Satan or make him prophetic.

By fairly plausible I've been pretty clear I mean the only fit thats comparable is the club of rome regional scheme

The myth of atlantis takes place in a remote past by definition nothing about that is prophetic saying hey this one element in the story matches more than literally anything else in the ancient world and John and his peers would have been familiar with it maybe there's some connection is not implying Satan has precognition anymore than anyone detecting or supposing any themes or patterns in history.

It's simple there seems four possibilities a. The ten kings are governments b. The ten kings are rulers c. The ten kings are bastards d. The ten kings are rulers possessed by bastards.

I'm not arguing for any position it very well could be the club of rome model but given what sea translates to in hebrew and given its one of the last enemies a new atlantis would not be odd as something contributing to the world government acquiring its power or the beasts empire itself as a neo atlantis.

12 “The ten horns which you saw are ten kings who have received no kingdom as yet, but they receive authority for one hour as kings with the beast. 13 These are of one mind, and they will give their power and authority to the beast. 14 These will make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb will overcome them, for He is Lord of lords and King of kings; and those who are with Him are called, chosen, and faithful.”
 
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Cristo

Well-known member
I don't mind your replies you are fine it's just you seem to read a heck of a lot into what I write. There is a lot of polemical interaction between Jehovah's camp and the enemies take Jesus walking on water or coming with the cloud of glory among other things that's mocking Baal the "cloud rider" I don't have the image at the moment but archeologist have found a large carving of Baal walking on water.

By the way Proverbs references a comparable work by a Pharoah as well as it's structure that doesn't have anything to do with Satan or make him prophetic.

By fairly plausible I've been pretty clear I mean the only fit thats comparable is the club of rome regional scheme

The myth of atlantis takes place in a remote past by definition nothing about that is prophetic saying hey this one element in the story matches more than literally anything else in the ancient world and John and his peers would have been familiar with it maybe there's some connection is not implying Satan has precognition anymore than anyone detecting or supposing any themes or patterns in history.

It's simple there seems four possibilities a. The ten kings are governments b. The ten kings are rulers c. The ten kings are bastards d. The ten kings are rulers possessed by bastards.

I'm not arguing for any position it very well could be the club of rome model but given what sea translates to in hebrew and given its one of the last enemies a new atlantis would not be odd as something contributing to the world government acquiring its power or the beasts empire itself as a neo atlantis.

12 “The ten horns which you saw are ten kings who have received no kingdom as yet, but they receive authority for one hour as kings with the beast. 13 These are of one mind, and they will give their power and authority to the beast. 14 These will make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb will overcome them, for He is Lord of lords and King of kings; and those who are with Him are called, chosen, and faithful.”
Ahhhh, ok I see where you are coming from now I 🤔 think. And yes I can see how that may have affected or rather was the etymology behind the club of Rome model that you are presenting as the ten kings from the scriptures. I’m not sure I entirely agree but I’m fairly sure I see what you are trying to convey. I’m at work so can’t contribute much but will consider more. Thanks GP
 

The God Pill

Well-known member
Ahhhh, ok I see where you are coming from now I 🤔 think. And yes I can see how that may have affected or rather was the etymology behind the club of Rome model that you are presenting as the ten kings from the scriptures. I’m not sure I entirely agree but I’m fairly sure I see what you are trying to convey. I’m at work so can’t contribute much but will consider more. Thanks GP
Yes essentially the ten zones is the best alternative to the atlantis hypothesis although they could also easily intersect.
 

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The God Pill

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Am getting pretty suspicious on Venus because Jupiter is the planet associated with Zeus hence the one of the Baal's that's Satan's equivalent if it's the adversaries planet and it ejected Venus a couple thousand years ago well after Adam and Eve then would whatever planetary consciousness or other entities associated with it be a product of him. Months ago my mind was going to the myth of Athena emerging from Zeus's forehead but was unsure because the planet Venus is more commonly thought of in relation to Aphrodite and her equivalents but found today long ago the author of world's of collision made that same connection of Venus and the myth of Athena. Makes one wonder how catastrophic it could be if jupiter ejects that other planet it's forming right now.


Interestingly in paradise lost John Milton even connected the devil with that myth of Zeus and Athena in his relationship with an allegorical personification of Sin part of a triad of Satan, sin and death
 

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Cristo

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1681499920361.jpeg@The God Pill, I’m curious GP, have you ever looked into the perspective that Saturn, the planet, had at one time been much closer to earth than it is today. There is a fascinating book called the Saturn Myth, by Dave Talbot, which is an extensive review of how the ancient civilizations viewed Saturn, calling it the morning star, the sun star, and even Helios. I do wonder if possibly Saturn was much closer to the earth and something caused it to be pushed out farther In the solar system. The asteroid belt that is between Jupiter and Mars may have been another planet? Asteroid? That hit Saturn and pushed it further out, which is why it now has rings around it as a memory of an ancient impact.

Saturn has all the elements needed to be a small sun, which it may have been prior to it being pushed away from earth. Perhaps the flood in Noahs time was an effect of an astronomical collision brought about by Jehovah, using an asteroid/planet to collide with Saturn and pushing it farther into the solar system. Its an interesting theory which is backed by some incredibly convincing arguments. I would be interested in your thoughts if you ever investigate into it.

 
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The God Pill

Well-known member
View attachment 3735@The God Pill, I’m curious GP, have you ever looked into the perspective that Saturn, the planet, had at one time been much closer to earth than it is today. There is a fascinating book called the Saturn Myth, by Dave Talbot, which is an extensive review of how the ancient civilizations viewed Saturn, calling it the morning star, the sun star, and even Helios. I do wonder if possibly Saturn was much closer to the earth and something caused it to be pushed out farther In the solar system. The asteroid belt that is between Jupiter and Mars may have been another planet? Asteroid? That hit Saturn and pushed it further out, which is why it now has rings around it as a memory of an ancient impact.

Saturn has all the elements needed to be a small sun, which it may have been prior to it being pushed away from earth. Perhaps the flood in Noahs time was an effect of an astronomical collision brought about by Jehovah, using an asteroid/planet to collide with Saturn and pushing it farther into the solar system. Its an interesting theory which is backed by some incredibly convincing arguments. I would be interested in your thoughts if you ever investigate into it.

I've watched a video or two by Anthony Patch on this topic a while back the model of an earlier Saturn centric solar system and golden age of chronos etc but haven't put enough hours into digging to say much.
 

Cristo

Well-known member
I've watched a video or two by Anthony Patch on this topic a while back the model of an earlier Saturn centric solar system and golden age of chronos etc but haven't put enough hours into digging to say much.
It is quite fascinating that Saturn was often called Helios to the ancient civilizations. Here are several quotations from sourced books detailing this phenomenon. There are several theories as to why Saturn would be equated with the Sun, however in my opinion, Lucifer the light bearer needed a place to call home. If he can have a throne here on earth(london), then why can he not also have one on Saturn, above the clouds.

Isaiah 14:12-15​

12 How you have fallen from heaven, morning star, son of the dawn! You have been cast down to the earth, you who once laid low the nations!
13 You said in your heart, “I will ascend to the heavens; I will raise my throne above the stars of God; I will sit enthroned on the mount of assembly, on the utmost heights of Mount Zaphon.
14 I will ascend above the tops of the clouds; I will make myself like the Most High.”

Perhaps the banishment to Tartarus, although no doubt a place of dense spiritual darkness to the fallen angels, also represents a limitation as to where the fallen angels can influence things within the physical universe, in order to prevent them from doing anymore damage than they have already done. The solar system, although big to us, would most certainly be a small prison for the spiritual beings confined within it, who no doubt could go anywhere they want within the universe. Knowing that this, the solar system, was all they had to work with, Saturn and his demons conjured up the plan for planet worship. It is in this way that Satan resides above man as their God, through Saturn(his heavenly throne), he misleads mankind to worship him. Anyways, just a theory I am working on at the moment.

Anyways, here is a short list of quotes presenting the Saturn = Helios information.


“From Testimonies of learned authors, which makes Saturn the same with Bel…”The Greeks” call Baal, Bel; who they say is the same with Saturn. The Phoenicians and Syrians call Saturn Bel and Hel; whence not improbably our old God Hel, formerly Famous in Britain, and the Father of our Cassibelinas is sometimes styled Hel, or Heli….”
-The Athenian oracle: Athenian society(1691-1697), pg.318

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”Haul: the sun. Gr., Helios. Heb., Halal, to shine. Helel., The morning star(Sun).
-Antiquae lingual britannicae thesaurus: Thomas Richards

Helel is also the name of Lucifer.
——​
”Helios, the Sun or Sun-god of Ancient Greece…The worship of the sun was practiced also among the ancient Roman’s, not however under the name of Helios which was particular to Greece, but under that of Sol.”
-The Faiths of the World: An account of All Religions and Religious…, Volume 2, (1858), pg. 16
—-


“Sol, Saturn, Jupiter, and Vulcan, were all one; being titles of the chief deity,-the Sun”
-The trinities of the ancients, Robert Mushet(1837), pg. 235
—-​
Kronos, of who Karnaios is a variant, also reappears as the radiant and glorious Sun-God in the familiar and beautiful passage in Pindar”
-Semitic Influence in Hellenic Mythology: Robert Brown(1898), pg. 117
—-​
The Egyptian counterpart of the Greek ‘Kronos’ was Keb[Geb] the Great Orb. Kronos when dissected becomes “AK-UR-ON-OS”, the great fire, the one Light…’AK, UR, and ON’ are three ancient names for the sun.”
-The Shining Ones, Philip Gardiner, Pg. 191
—-​
“The celebrated ancient poet of Nonus, gives to Hercules the name of Helios, or Sun, and further says, that he is the same god that divers people adore under a host of different names-as Belus upon the shores of the Euphrates, Ammon in Lydia, Apis in Memphis, Saturn in Arabia, Jupiter in Assyria, Serapis in Egypt, Helios with the Babylonians, Apollo at Delphi, and Esculapius in all Greece.”
-The existence of Christ disproved by irresistible evidence, in a series of letters by a German Jew(1843), pg 86
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“Phoebus-Apollo was the god of light in a twofold signification: first, as representing the great orb of day which illuminates the world; and secondly, as the heavenly light which animates the soul of man. He inherited his function as sun-god from Helios…”
-The Myths and Legends of Ancient Greece and Rome: E.M. Berens(1880), pg 70
—-​
Greek astronomical lore also preserves Saturn’s connection with the Sun. With reference to the Babylonian star-worshippers, the chronicler Diodorus writes: “To the one we call Saturn they give a special name, ‘Sun-star.’” Various manuscripts of the Epinomis, traditionally ascribed to Plato but now thought to be the work of Philip of Opus, substitute the name Helios for Kronos, in apparent recognition of the ancient identification of Saturn as the star of the sun.”
-Martian Metamorphoses: The Planet Mars in Ancient Myth and Religion, pg. 59
—-​
According to Ptolemy, the people of Persia and Mesopotamia worship the star Aphrodite(Venus), naming it Isis, and the star Kronos(Saturn) as Mithras Helios. Saturn, known as the nocturnal Sun…”
-The Dying God: The Hidden history of Western Civilizations: by David Livingston, Pg. 194
—-​
”Diodorus Siculus reported that the Chaldeans called Cronus (Saturnus) by the name Helios, or the Sun, and he explained that this was because Saturn was the "most conspicuous" of the planets.“
—-​
“The star the Greeks call Kronos they call the star Helios-meaning that Saturn is identified with the sun…”
-Ancient Astronomy and Celestial Divination, Noel M. Swerdlow, pg. 2



For those who want to read an incredibly well written research article about Saturns baffling association with the sun, and why Saturn was deemed to be ‘black’.
Saturn as the “Sun of Night” in Ancient Near Eastern Tradition∗

 
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The God Pill

Well-known member
Tartarus is a prison the entities Peter referred to are already in prison the lowest area of Sheol. That scarcely means the adversary doesn't have other accomplices. The Abyss. In Greek mythology tartarus was as far below Hades as Hades is below the earth's surface. It appears the most sound position is that the bastards fathers are imprisoned deep in the earth but perhaps the stars that transgressed earlier are in another prison within our realm

 
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