Chapter 16 - An Eighth King

SusanB

SusanB

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For probably 30 years I was wrongly thinking that the last world power under human rulership was going to be the Anglo-American dyad but that’s why we have God’s word so that it can correct us. Chapter 16 starts with quoting Revelation 17:11 which explains that the 8th King springs from the 7 but goes off into destruction and so it is actually the 8th King that is the final stand for human rulership under Satan. Perhaps it is contained in another chapter, but one piece of information that, for me, has the “ring” of truth is the fact that the image in Daniel in its entirety symbolizes the 8th King. It is the culmination or perhaps Satan’s best shot at opposing Jehovah’s sovereignty, and all of the other 7 human kingdoms up to this point have merely been a stepping stone to this coming ultimate showdown.

At the time that Robert King wrote this chapter, we did not have war in Ukraine and yet today we are experiencing that. So these opening paragraphs have that “wow” factor when reading them in light of current events. Just as Putin had warned the world that he would not tolerate having American/NATO war weapons at Russia’s doorstep and then the world acts surprised when he actually takes action, it will likely also be the case with nuclear armaments. At least that seems plausible to me. He has clearly warned all where the world is heading and it is probably now the time for him to take action once again. But here is a quote from the beginning of this chapter 16:

”After the collapse of the USSR, a small clique of so-called neoconservatives (neo- cons) saw an opportunity to use the economic and military power of the United States to establish a new world order — an Anglo-dominated world government. Seizing upon the Saudi 9-11 operation as a pretext for war, the US and its NATO allies have set about to rearrange the nations of the Middle East for the purpose of militarily encircling Russia and China.

One more step in that direction was the orchestration of a neo-Nazi coup in Ukraine, with the intention of bringing NATO up to Russia’s very border. However, in September of 2015 Vladimir Putin announced before the UN Annual General Assembly that the present state of affairs was no longer tolerable. A few days later Russian warplanes began bombing ISIS positions in Syria. By doing so Russia has unequivocally demonstrated that it is not going to submit to America’s bid for world domination. This development has brought two blocs of nuclear-armed nations into direct conflict.

Although there has been no direct military engagement yet, the prelude to open warfare is already in motion; namely, propaganda war, cyber war, and financial/ monetary war.”
 
SusanB said:
For probably 30 years I was wrongly thinking that the last world power under human rulership was going to be the Anglo-American dyad but that’s why we have God’s word so that it can correct us.
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We were all taught and also indoctrinated by the Watchtower. The poor brothers at Bethel are the most indoctrinated. They are all institutionalized to the point they cannot find their way out of the little organizational box they are in. What is the solution? It is becoming my go-to scripture: "Only terror will make them understand."
 
Here is a link to An Eighth King

Susan, I don't know if you were going to delve into it, but one of the surest bits of evidence that the Watchtower is exerting a deluding influence over Jehovah's Witnesses has to do with their treatment of the mark of the beast. Here is a quote from their Revelation commentary:
“Mankind has been put under compulsion to accept the mark of the wild beast, with the intent that “nobody might be able to buy or sell except a person having the mark, the name of the wild beast or the number of its name.” But there is a price to pay for this! Jehovah regards those who accept the mark as being stricken with “a hurtful and malignant ulcer.” Since 1922 they have been marked in public as having rejected the living God.”
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For one thing, how would it have been possible for people living in the United States, for example, to be put under compulsion to obey the League of Nations when the US was not even a member of that organization? Can any of Jehovah's Witnesses explain how anyone has been prevented from doing business, buying and selling? Of course not. It is a fairy tale. How has mankind been publicly marked for having rejected God? They haven't. It is a myth. By the way, most JWs are not even aware, but all during the 1920s the Watchtower taught that the parousia had begun in 1874 and that the Kingdom came to power in 1878. So, why would God condemn mankind for not believing what the Watchtower itself eventually repudiated as fiction?
 
I know that I’m “preaching to the choir” on this point but it’s so interesting to me to have learned it through Robert King’s book. The Anglo-American dyad has it roots in the Roman Empire. Another puzzle piece that has a perfect fit. The question that is asked is whether the 7th beast has revived from a mortal blow and I think we can all acknowledge what is obvious that fulfillment has only happened in the mind of the blind.

”The five kings that had fallen before Revelation was written are those kings mentioned in the Bible that have dominated God’s people in the past, namely: Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, Medo-Persia, and Greece, in that order. The one that “is” was the Roman king that was ruling when John received the Revelation. The Roman king held domination by means of the Roman Catholic Church far beyond the time that historians mark as the fall of the formal Roman Empire. Finally, as a former Roman outpost, England gradually emerged in the place of the Roman king. And with the ascendancy of the British Empire in the late 1700’s, London has held that position up to the beginning of the 20th Century. The king that had “not yet arrived” (from John’s perspective) has proven to be the Anglo-American dual world power.

But the question to consider is whether the prophecy that calls for one of the heads of the wild beast to receive a mortal wound and then revive has been fulfilled yet.”
 
I broke this post up into 2 posts because its easier to read 2 shorter posts than one long one, at least in my opinion. This described how I have learned Jehovah to be from his word and that he is not random or unclear. In fact Jehovah himself tells us at 1 Corinthians 14:8: “For if the trumpet sounds an indistinct call, who will get ready for battle?” The coming ”battle” between God’s Kingdom and human satanic rulership will be epic and the most important and decisive battle in human history and so I KNOW Jehovah will not be random nor unclear/vague.

“Jehovah is the God of justice. His judgments are not random. His judicial decision decrees the sentence of permanent death for every person who worships the wild beast or its image after the point at which the beast revives and its image miraculously comes to life, because doing so at that time will demonstrate an unequivocal rejection of Christ as ruler. That is the basis for the judgment to come.

The notion that the Anglo-American head of the beast suffered the prophetic fatal stroke during the First World War is simply not based in reality. It is a fiction. Likewise, the Watchtower’s assertion that the mere formation of the United Nations after WWII was somehow the beginning of the awesome judgment of Jehovah is absurd. Furthermore, it is unreasonable that God would judge mankind based upon their attitude towards the now-irrelevant League of Nations or its presently enfeebled successor—the United Nations Organization.”
 
SusanB said:
I broke this post up into 2 posts because its easier to read 2 shorter posts than one long one, at least in my opinion. This described how I have learned Jehovah to be from his word and that he is not random or unclear. In fact Jehovah himself tells us at 1 Corinthians 14:8: “For if the trumpet sounds an indistinct call, who will get ready for battle?” The coming ”battle” between God’s Kingdom and human satanic rulership will be epic and the most important and decisive battle in human history and so I KNOW Jehovah will not be random nor unclear/vague.

“Jehovah is the God of justice. His judgments are not random. His judicial decision decrees the sentence of permanent death for every person who worships the wild beast or its image after the point at which the beast revives and its image miraculously comes to life, because doing so at that time will demonstrate an unequivocal rejection of Christ as ruler. That is the basis for the judgment to come.

The notion that the Anglo-American head of the beast suffered the prophetic fatal stroke during the First World War is simply not based in reality. It is a fiction. Likewise, the Watchtower’s assertion that the mere formation of the United Nations after WWII was somehow the beginning of the awesome judgment of Jehovah is absurd. Furthermore, it is unreasonable that God would judge mankind based upon their attitude towards the now-irrelevant League of Nations or its presently enfeebled successor—the United Nations Organization.”
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It is crazy, the WT teaches that the hour of test that is coming upon the inhabited earth began way back in 1914. I have noticed though that as time goes on the WT says less and less about prophecy. They must have decided to just let it all go, phase it out, and hope no one will notice.
 
Watchman said:
It is crazy, the WT teaches that the hour of test that is coming upon the inhabited earth began way back in 1914. I have noticed though that as time goes on the WT says less and less about prophecy. They must have decided to just let it all go, phase it out, and hope no one will notice.
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They have decided it's more in their wheel house to buy and sell real-estate and squeeze the monetary juice out of our older brothers and sisters. To teach true understanding of prophecy is to hard, gives them a head ache.
 
Watchman said:
It is crazy, the WT teaches that the hour of test that is coming upon the inhabited earth began way back in 1914. I have noticed though that as time goes on the WT says less and less about prophecy. They must have decided to just let it all go, phase it out, and hope no one will notice.
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That is their MO. Ignore the obvious until it becomes moot.
 
Watchman said:
It is crazy, the WT teaches that the hour of test that is coming upon the inhabited earth began way back in 1914. I have noticed though that as time goes on the WT says less and less about prophecy. They must have decided to just let it all go, phase it out, and hope no one will notice.
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Maybe they're reading your writings and have come to understand prophecy is finding them out. Time for a bit of mis-direct on the congregation prehaps.
 
When refreshing my memory on the explanations in the book I like to focus on what is the correct understanding and as much as possible just ignore the false teaching but at times it is necessary to recall what the org teaches in order to have context. In Chapter 16 Robert King states:

”Incredibly, just as the Watchtower has two different interpretations for the beast from the abyss, they also have assigned two different dates for the beginning of the final judgment of the world—both 1922 and 1945!”

and then this clear (and hope filled) understanding is stated:

”In reality, the Watchtower’s teaching is blasphemous for the reason that it makes Jehovah’s judgments arbitrary and petty. But as Paul might say: Never may that happen! Given that the symbolic mark of the beast is permanent and results in irreversible damnation, it is not possible for anyone with the mark of the beast to ever repent and gain Jehovah’s approval. Clearly, then, no one has the mark of the beast yet. Otherwise, it would even be impossible for anyone who has ever supported the political system in the past to repent and receive salvation. What would be the point of preaching the good news of salvation to a world that had been irrevocably condemned to everlasting destruction? But the fact that even large numbers of Jehovah’s Witnesses were formerly quite active in supporting the present political system—even serving in the military— proves that the Watchtower’s interpretations are in error.

Jehovah is the God of justice. His judgments are not random. His judicial decision decrees the sentence of permanent death for every person who worships the wild beast or its image after the point at which the beast revives and its image miraculously comes to life, because doing so at that time will demonstrate an unequivocal rejection of Christ as ruler. That is the basis for the judgment to come.”

When thinking of this point I recall the bible account at 1 Kings 18 with Elijah where there is a demonstration between Baal and Jehovah. It created a clear separation. That gives us insight into how Jehovah allows people to make a clear choice and I think we will see something similar regarding the mark of the beast.
 
This is definitely one of my favorite chapters in the book. The fact that RK identifies, the true KON, and then this insight on the 8th King was just another nail in the coffin for me for WT! I have wondered for most of my adult life how the UN could possibly carry out WT absurd notion that the GT would start when the UN unites the entire world away from all or their other interests conflicts, and are able to get them to sideline their differences and somehow convince every nation on earth, the real problem in the World is religion, and like this conflict between Ukraine and Russia would just be sidelined somehow.

Like i have said many times, if everything WT claims about all the fulfilled prophecies, what is Jehovah waiting for to bring about the end? This is what it means where it says the "evil slave is saying the master is delaying." They have appointed themselves as the prophets of Jehovah and the faithful slave, and their response to correction will be exactly the same response they have when anyone questions or disagrees with the GB. They DF you. They are no different than the arrogant nations who cannot be corrected either, because they have become puff up with pride. They will reject Jesus second coming exactly the same way the Pharisees did. History is repeating itself.

I think also, the direction they have taken with their monthly updates, and all their TV evangelizing, has revealed to those of us "with eyes to see and ears to hear" to see their true colors. @SusanB I wish I could find it now, but you made another comment, just in the last day or two, that is exactly the same way I see things too along these same lines.

Any way, I'm glad you're posting these. I may not comment on all of them, because this is the real "meat and potatoes" and it actually takes time and some thinking to make a meaningful comment, but I have been reading each post. RK's book is one of my favorite topics to be sure. I think of his book like the mirror that Perseus holds up to Medusa! A mirror held up to WT, it's so ugly it kills them when they see their own reflection, and this is why they hate descent so much.
 
SusanB said:
For probably 30 years I was wrongly thinking that the last world power under human rulership was going to be the Anglo-American dyad but that’s why we have God’s word so that it can correct us. Chapter 16 starts with quoting Revelation 17:11 which explains that the 8th King springs from the 7 but goes off into destruction and so it is actually the 8th King that is the final stand for human rulership under Satan. Perhaps it is contained in another chapter, but one piece of information that, for me, has the “ring” of truth is the fact that the image in Daniel in its entirety symbolizes the 8th King. It is the culmination or perhaps Satan’s best shot at opposing Jehovah’s sovereignty, and all of the other 7 human kingdoms up to this point have merely been a stepping stone to this coming ultimate showdown.

At the time that Robert King wrote this chapter, we did not have war in Ukraine and yet today we are experiencing that. So these opening paragraphs have that “wow” factor when reading them in light of current events. Just as Putin had warned the world that he would not tolerate having American/NATO war weapons at Russia’s doorstep and then the world acts surprised when he actually takes action, it will likely also be the case with nuclear armaments. At least that seems plausible to me. He has clearly warned all where the world is heading and it is probably now the time for him to take action once again. But here is a quote from the beginning of this chapter 16:

”After the collapse of the USSR, a small clique of so-called neoconservatives (neo- cons) saw an opportunity to use the economic and military power of the United States to establish a new world order — an Anglo-dominated world government. Seizing upon the Saudi 9-11 operation as a pretext for war, the US and its NATO allies have set about to rearrange the nations of the Middle East for the purpose of militarily encircling Russia and China.

One more step in that direction was the orchestration of a neo-Nazi coup in Ukraine, with the intention of bringing NATO up to Russia’s very border. However, in September of 2015 Vladimir Putin announced before the UN Annual General Assembly that the present state of affairs was no longer tolerable. A few days later Russian warplanes began bombing ISIS positions in Syria. By doing so Russia has unequivocally demonstrated that it is not going to submit to America’s bid for world domination. This development has brought two blocs of nuclear-armed nations into direct conflict.

Although there has been no direct military engagement yet, the prelude to open warfare is already in motion; namely, propaganda war, cyber war, and financial/ monetary war.”
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I'm curious about this. I've been a JW for 30 years, too, and we've gone through the Revelation book 4 times. I always understood that the 8th king was the UN and that they would rule for "an hour". This is in that red Revelation book, too. I realize that WT thinks that the last government is the US/UK but they have also said that the UN would rule for one hour and we know that the UN is made up of humans. So I guess I've always thought that....
 
Nomex said:
This is definitely one of my favorite chapters in the book. The fact that RK identifies, the true KON, and then this insight on the 8th King was just another nail in the coffin for me for WT! I have wondered for most of my adult life how the UN could possibly carry out WT absurd notion that the GT would start when the UN unites the entire world away from all or their other interests conflicts, and are able to get them to sideline their differences and somehow convince every nation on earth, the real problem in the World is religion, and like this conflict between Ukraine and Russia would just be sidelined somehow.

Like i have said many times, if everything WT claims about all the fulfilled prophecies, what is Jehovah waiting for to bring about the end? This is what it means where it says the "evil slave is saying the master is delaying." They have appointed themselves as the prophets of Jehovah and the faithful slave, and their response to correction will be exactly the same response they have when anyone questions or disagrees with the GB. They DF you. They are no different than the arrogant nations who cannot be corrected either, because they have become puff up with pride. They will reject Jesus second coming exactly the same way the Pharisees did. History is repeating itself.

I think also, the direction they have taken with their monthly updates, and all their TV evangelizing, has revealed to those of us "with eyes to see and ears to hear" to see their true colors. @SusanB I wish I could find it now, but you made another comment, just in the last day or two, that is exactly the same way I see things too along these same lines.

Any way, I'm glad you're posting these. I may not comment on all of them, because this is the real "meat and potatoes" and it actually takes time and some thinking to make a meaningful comment, but I have been reading each post. RK's book is one of my favorite topics to be sure. I think of his book like the mirror that Perseus holds up to Medusa! A mirror held up to WT, it's so ugly it kills them when they see their own reflection, and this is why they hate descent so much.
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It's interesting. In Genesis 18, Abraham questions Jehovah about "are you really going to destroy Sodom and Gomorrah if 50 righteous people live in the city? 40? 30? etc. Did Jehovah react negatively and threaten to kill Abraham for lack of faith or insubordination? No. Then why in the world does the GB think they are above that? Even Jesus didn't DF Peter when he said "be kind to yourself" or when he denied him 3x and had wrong thinking. What hypocrisy.

I agree on the televangelism appearance. It's gross. Mark Sanderson and Stephen Lett seem so fake I can't stand it some times.
 
StopTheInsanity said:
No. Then why in the world does the GB think they are above that? Even Jesus didn't DF Peter when he said "be kind to yourself" or when he denied him 3x and had wrong thinking.
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I have pointed out many times, that Jehovah did not stop Satan from "spreading his apostate driven lies" to Adam and Eve. Freewill, dictates that we have free will, that is to say free choice. So the very fact that WT and the GB does everything to stop any dissemination of information that paints them in a negative light, is the best evidence they do not have Jehovah's spirit. Only liars who don';t want the truth to see the light of day, try to suppress information. If you are truthful you welcome all the information. Because if you are telling the truth, the facts bear that up. If you are lying and a liar, the truth exposes that you are a liar. The reason, and the only reason you ever try to shut someone up, is not because they are lying, but because they are telling the truth. It is the reason the 1st amendment is the 1st amendment!
 
Nomex said:
I have pointed out many times, that Jehovah did not stop Satan from "spreading his apostate driven lies" to Adam and Eve. Freewill, dictates that we have free will, that is to say free choice. So the very fact that WT and the GB does everything to stop any dissemination of information that paints them in a negative light, is the best evidence they do not have Jehovah's spirit. Only liars who don';t want the truth to see the light of day, try to suppress information. If you are truthful you welcome all the information. Because if you are telling the truth, the facts bear that up. If you are lying and a liar, the truth exposes that you are a liar. The reason, and the only reason you ever try to shut someone up, is not because they are lying, but because they are telling the truth. It is the reason the 1st amendment is the 1st amendment!
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Unity is more important than Truth… that is what the WT promotes.
 
Did anyone else notice the word “cosmocracy” in this chapter? I had to look that one up and I hadn’t heard that before. The definition of cosmocracy is control of the whole world. This quote from his book is why Robert King says that when The Great Tribulation takes place, that is when we will know that Satan has been thrown out of heaven and down to the earth. At least that is what I am recalling that I have read. Here is the quote:

”Since Satan himself is depicted in Revelation as a seven-headed dragon, it is evident that his invisible cosmocracy has been manifest through the corresponding seven heads of the beast-like political apparatus on earth. And although it has already been stated in the previous chapter, it seems worth repeating here: The seventh head that is slaughtered to death is merely a reflection of the blow that Satan himself receives as a result of Christ ousting him and his angels from heaven.

More than likely the Devil’s wrath will provoke the use of nuclear weapons and other weapons of mass destruction. Apparently, it is at the stage when all seems lost and civilization is poised to simply unravel and disintegrate, that the seemingly, fatally wounded beast makes a miraculous recovery, so as to appear as the savior of the world.”
 
SusanB said:
Apparently, it is at the stage when all seems lost and civilization is poised to simply unravel and disintegrate, that the seemingly, fatally wounded beast makes a miraculous recovery, so as to appear as the savior of the world.”
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This is exactly why I think they will manifest themselves in some way. They will want to take credit for the fact that Jehovah has stopped the GT, and to be able to appear as saviors, they will have to display their power/s, in such a convincing manner, so as to "compel" people to take the MOB! They will have "compelling" "evidence" for believing the last of Satan's lies, before Armageddon. I think they will not be able to do that "invisibly." I suppose they will portray themselves as "Aliens" here to save us from ourselves!
 
Nomex said:
This is exactly why I think they will manifest themselves in some way. They will want to take credit for the fact that Jehovah has stopped the GT, and to be able to appear as saviors, they will have to display their power/s, in such a convincing manner, so as to "compel" people to take the MOB! They will have "compelling" "evidence" for believing the last of Satan's lies, before Armageddon. I think they will not be able to do that "invisibly." I suppose they will portray themselves as "Aliens" here to save us from ourselves!
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I know that you quoted my post but I just want to be clear that the quote is actually words of Robert King and not my words.
 
This chapter ends with these 2 paragraphs:

”The crash of the present governmental system will likely be followed by the imposition of a form of global communism. In that way, everyone on earth would be brought into a situation that no one could buy or sell without acknowledging the image of the beast. The “one hour” allotted to the eighth king coincides with the hour of test Jesus referred to in the third chapter of Revelation, where he promised the faithful: “Because you kept the word about my endurance, I will also keep you from the hour of test, which is to come upon the entire inhabited earth, to put to the test those dwelling on the earth.”

The test that is coming upon the world will force all men to demonstrate their allegiance either to Satan’s “miraculously” resuscitated political beast or to Jehovah’s kingship. That is when the angel announces to the world: “Fear God and give him glory, because the hour of judgment by him has arrived.”
 
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