In the Image of God

Cristo

Well-known member
We were created in God's image. An image is a reflection of something. Every choice we make is either a reflection of God's purpose, or it isn't. It is that simple. When the choice is in harmony with his purpose, we are reflecting back like we were created to, but when we don't reflect it, it is because the sin within us has prevented it. Sin blocks the reflection of love and creates death.

Because we were made in God's image, our very essence is endowed with the ability to create, in the fullest sense of the word. Everything you do is a creation, and I mean everything. You create subconsciously without even thinking about it. Your mind creates impulses to sustain life through the beating of the heart and taking of a breath, it is all done with a creation.

When you get up in the morning, you had to create the idea first and bring it to fruition by the action. You create the impulses in your mind first before any muscle moves in your body. You are creating right now by reading these words. Your eyes are creating nerve impulses that are sent to your brain to interpret them as sight. Your ears create impulses that your brain interprets as sounds. Every sense we have is a creation factory. I'm sure you get the point. Creation permeates every aspect of our existence. When we can no longer create anymore we die.

Of course, those creations are automatic; we don't need to think about them, they just create. We also have the ability to take our ideas and thoughts, which are a creation on a different level, and manifest them into existence. There is no limit to our creative abilities within this physical universe, for whatever it is we can think of, we can create it. Look around you, show me one thing that isn't created. We are creators, just as the God who created us to be in his image is.

“. . .Why, now there is nothing that they may have in mind to do that will be unattainable for them. . .” (Ge 11:6)​

This is where free will comes in. Free will is what gives us the ability to decide whether what we create is in line with God's purpose or isn't. God is the one who set the standard, and prior to the sin, all the angels used their free will to always create good. All they had knowledge of was good. They perfectly reflected back God's love by choosing to reflect his image back to him through their actions. It creates a homeostasis in which creation works for the survival of itself, and order is maintained to the glory of the creator. It's perfect.

Because its perfect, God expects perfection from his creation because they were created within it. Sin is the action of creating imperfection. It creates an imbalance and an entropy within creation, which is why it cannot be tolerated; it would destroy that which God created.

When Satan lied he was creating something that goes contrary to Gods purpose. Satan created sin, he is the manifester of it, and created something that did not exist prior. He is the father of it. He used his free will and chose to create something that cannot be sustained within a perfect environment; thus he is no longer perfect.

I am so thankful that we have a God that not only loves us so much that he created us, but that he understands that we cannot help but to create sin and offered us a way out. That he gave us a King, and redeemer of that imperfection, to eventually make us whole again, and to one day be able to only create that which is good, and loving, and sustaining for all eternity. I love Jehovah and his son Jesus Christ.
 
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alan ford

Well-known member
We were created in God's image. An image is a reflection of something.
Hi Cristo, I got a question regarding the quoted part. Bible says in Genesis 5:1 that Adam was created in the image of God alright, but Genesis 5:3 says When Adam was 130 years old, he had a son in his own likeness, after his own image; and he named him Seth. Does this mean that Adam wasn't in the image of God after he sinned? Can we as sinners be in the image of God? To me it implies that we, being removed from God by the sin, are now in the image of Adam. I'm thinking that by accepting Jesus' sacrifice and accepting his principles, we are given the opportunity to be brought back into the image of God.
 

Patricia

Well-known member
Hi Cristo, I got a question regarding the quoted part. Bible says in Genesis 5:1 that Adam was created in the image of God alright, but Genesis 5:3 says When Adam was 130 years old, he had a son in his own likeness, after his own image; and he named him Seth. Does this mean that Adam wasn't in the image of God after he sinned? Can we as sinners be in the image of God? To me it implies that we, being removed from God by the sin, are now in the image of Adam. I'm thinking that by accepting Jesus' sacrifice and accepting his principles, we are given the opportunity to be brought back into the image of God.
I'm not Christo but 1 Corinthians 11:7 speaks about a man not covering his head "since he is the image and glory of God". So imo, still in the image of God, even if not reflecting perfectly. 🤔
 

alan ford

Well-known member
I'm not Christo but 1 Corinthians 11:7 speaks about a man not covering his head "since he is the image and glory of God". So imo, still in the image of God, even if not reflecting perfectly. 🤔
Thank you :) There are also some other scriptures by Paul that speak about image or likeness of God:

Ephesians 4:23, 24 ...to be renewed in the spirit of your minds, and to put on the new self, created after the likeness of God in true righteousness and holiness.

Colossians 3:9,10 ...seeing that you have put off the old self with its practices and have put on the new self, which is being renewed in knowledge after the image of its creator.

But I think that it makes sense when you say "still in the image of God, even if not reflecting perfectly." After all we still possess the qualities that God endowed us with, along with free will and creative capacity that Cristo described.
 

KingdomLeast

Well-known member
We were created in God's image. An image is a reflection of something.
"So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them." - Gen 1:27

So is God "male and female"?

Bible says in Genesis 5:1 that Adam was created in the image of God alright, but Genesis 5:3 says When Adam was 130 years old, he had a son in his own likeness, after his own image; and he named him Seth. Does this mean that Adam wasn't in the image of God after he sinned? Can we as sinners be in the image of God?
I don't believe that sin destroyed the image of God in man. Let's look at Genesis 9:6 "whoever sheds man’s blood, By man his blood shall be shed; For in the image of God He made man." This verse tells us that even after the fall, mankind is still made in the "image of God." Humanity still reflect, in some way, the dignity of the Lord, no matter how we have marred His image.
 

alan ford

Well-known member
I don't believe that sin destroyed the image of God in man. Let's look at Genesis 9:6 "whoever sheds man’s blood, By man his blood shall be shed; For in the image of God He made man." This verse tells us that even after the fall, mankind is still made in the "image of God." Humanity still reflect, in some way, the dignity of the Lord, no matter how we have marred His image.
I agree. I guess I was just entertaining a thought based on Gen 5:3. And as Patricia pointed out, man is "the image and glory of God".
 

BARNABY THE DOG.

Well-known member
"So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them." - Gen 1:27

So is God "male and female"?


I don't believe that sin destroyed the image of God in man. Let's look at Genesis 9:6 "whoever sheds man’s blood, By man his blood shall be shed; For in the image of God He made man." This verse tells us that even after the fall, mankind is still made in the "image of God." Humanity still reflect, in some way, the dignity of the Lord, no matter how we have marred His image.
I think it applies more to the ownership in the creation of man, than to man retaining that image. Jehovah made man perfect. It took a perfect man to replace that image with the promise. Thus man has brought this imperfection upon himself and thus Jehovah leaves that consequence with mankind. How can Jehovah stoop to mediate the evil that man has brought upon himself? Rather, he lets man deliver their own justice. Jehovah even sets out how man may be able to do this via the commandments. To say that we still reflect the essence of Jehovah’s attributes that he instilled in Adam is certainly true in a superficial way, - it is part of our sense of being that our brain allows us insight to - but could it actually be worthy of note without the sacrifice of Jesus? The bible suggests that the sense of our own weaknesses is self evident. “Miserable man that I am, for what I should do, I do not do…” thus we are beyond any likeness to Jehovah without the sacrifice. So what image are we actually reflecting? That of our own failure. If there is an image to reflect of what man could have been, surely that is seen in Christ?
 

Cristo

Well-known member
Hi Cristo, I got a question regarding the quoted part. Bible says in Genesis 5:1 that Adam was created in the image of God alright, but Genesis 5:3 says When Adam was 130 years old, he had a son in his own likeness, after his own image; and he named him Seth. Does this mean that Adam wasn't in the image of God after he sinned? Can we as sinners be in the image of God? To me it implies that we, being removed from God by the sin, are now in the image of Adam. I'm thinking that by accepting Jesus' sacrifice and accepting his principles, we are given the opportunity to be brought back into the image of God.
Hey Alan, looks like it's already been answered, but in my mind once created in his image always created in his image, as to take away from anything would go against his purpose for creating that creation in his image in the first place. Habakkuk states:

(Hab 1:13) “. . .You are too pure in eyes to see what is bad; and to look on trouble you are not able. . .”

Obviously, God can see badness and is able to look at somebody who is committing trouble, the point is that God is pure in every quality, and his creation is pure as well, thus why would he ever tolerate anything less from his creation, he is God, and his standard is perfection.

When Satan created sin, and now had knowledge of bad, he proved that free will existed within Gods creation; his act contradicted his fundamental nature of embodying God's image. His lie was an imperfect creation manifested by his desire to deviate from Gods standard and create his own. I find it fascinating that, as the original post above discussed, EVERYTHING we do represents a creation, consciously or subconsciously, and the same holds true for the angels no doubt. When Satan broke the law of free will, which is unmistakably a divine statute, it was a departure from the image of God, and it defied the standard that was preordained by God before creation itself.

Every creation that comes to exist is a manifestation of purpose somehow, and these creations reverberate within and without. When all creation is good these reverberations are a harmonious frequency that are aligned with Gods purpose, and because he is pure they reflect or resonate back to him as a perfect reflection should, in purity.

I find the whole thing fascinating to be honest, as I think most do as well who appreciate what Jehovah has done, and that he loved us so much that he purposed a solution to our dreadful state of imperfection.

That of our own failure. If there is an image to reflect of what man could have been, surely that is seen in Christ?
Amen brother. I'm certain we both share the hope of living in a place where we can all reflect how we were supposed to.


"So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them." - Gen 1:27

So is God "male and female"?

As once stated by our loving creator, "I shall prove to be what I shall prove to be". I think that covers it....
 

BARNABY THE DOG.

Well-known member
"So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them." - Gen 1:27

So is God "male and female"?


I don't believe that sin destroyed the image of God in man. Let's look at Genesis 9:6 "whoever sheds man’s blood, By man his blood shall be shed; For in the image of God He made man." This verse tells us that even after the fall, mankind is still made in the "image of God." Humanity still reflect, in some way, the dignity of the Lord, no matter how we have marred His image.
“Is God male and female?”
When you look at the construct of the male and female thought processes, their respective sense of what is perceived (commonly known as the sense of “what happens” to an individual), it’s meaning and application to one’s self, then it is clear that the sexes (I mean male and female - not any of the new inventions) compliment each other. In fact, these differences in perceptions of ‘“what happens” - what is experienced by the individual and intrinsically, what that means to the individual, has recently been proven and published In respected medical journals.

The fact that male and female perceive the many of the same things differently is a genuine pearl of design by Jehovah. These different aspect within the experience of life seen from the same point of view, but understood in different ways - sometimes as closely as the “bone is to the marrow,“ sometimes objectively yards apart to the point of being black and white, creates a bond between man and wife, that actually draws them together, binds them in love and dependability, trust, peace and in an adventurous outlook together. It is an incredible act of creation to make life so similar, yet so diverse, that male and female can be enriched in their life perspectives in this way. If you think about it, what could make a stronger bond than mental contribution to another’s enrichment in perspective? It adds value, which in turn adds endearment, respect, honour, companionship, closeness, dependability, trust, togetherness, understanding, forethought, and contributes to acts of love such as giving, choice, surprises, gifts that touch the heart and show deep appreciation. It’s a wonderful, wonderful provision, that is so overlooked.

Of course, you are absolutely correct that Jehovah is both male and female because the addition of the two halves makes perfection, and you cannot make a more perfect match for human beings by having each sex hold the key to completeness for the other. What mankind does not see is the completeness in understanding of what constitutes love (and which constitutes the complete construct of life) because that is what Jehovah alone possesses, but it is not beyond us to contemplate that source, is it? We see it within the marriage bond, albeit through a glass differently. But consider this; what does the marriage of the lamb signify in the completion of Jehovah’s purpose? Think of the coming together of the Spirit in that glorious Union of completion of purpose when Jehovah takes back what is rightfully His and the entire creation comes to know the fullness of its creator. Also bear in mind, the completeness of the anointed where none are given or taken in marriage. What would be the need when one is at complete unity in the one God? Jehovah is referred to as He. Jehovah made man the head of the woman. That is the way of things. But it is and order of things In the presentation of life to mankind so that we may understand order in our lives. Jehovah is the completeness of life. Thus all expression of life is complete within him. Male and female were created within that completeness.
 

Bk Kevin

Well-known member
You said "When Satan created sin, and now had knowledge of bad, end quote.
I think what you meant to say is that Satan initiated sin because the knowledge to do good or bad already existed
in Jehovah's Heavenly organization according to Genesis 3:22-B And Jehovah God went on to say: “Here the man has become like one of us in knowing good and bad,. Other than that I thought it was a good read thank you.
 

Cristo

Well-known member
You said "When Satan created sin, and now had knowledge of bad, end quote.
I think what you meant to say is that Satan initiated sin because the knowledge to do good or bad already existed
in Jehovah's Heavenly organization according to Genesis 3:22-B And Jehovah God went on to say: “Here the man has become like one of us in knowing good and bad,. Other than that I thought it was a good read thank you.
Thank you for the kind words, I appreciate that. I actually did mean what I said, please allow me to elaborate a bit more to help you understand the perspective I am coming from.

The knowledge to do something is entirely different from the knowledge of actually doing it. Having an awareness of one's ability to act doesn't guarantee that the action will be taken, or that it can be, until it is enacted.

When it comes to creation knowing badness, It is impossible to know something that does not exist, and up until the time of the first sin badness did not exist within creation. The scripture you provide from Genesis is in the context of Jehovah talking to Jesus, the same as when he said "Let US make man in our image..."

Certainly Jehovah, and Jesus Christ as his master worker, both know good and bad, for they are the ones who set the standard for what is good and bad. You cannot set a standard for anything unless you first know the limits or boundaries in which to set it.

All aspects of creation adhere to a framework of standards and laws established by God, governing their existence within His intended purpose. Take, for example, the concept of time, which operates within its own set of standards and laws, enabling our existence. A simpler analogy can be found in the speed of light, which abides by the law that it cannot exceed 182,282 miles per second. Each element of creation operates within these established standards, with God's perfection serving as the ultimate benchmark. Thus, the laws governing existence are intricately aligned to ensure the perfection and order of creation. We have knowledge of these standards because they have been established as existing within creation through the observance of them.

Before sin entered into creation, the concept of the law of free will had not yet been established, nor had the consequences of breaking it been demonstrated. While God sets the standards and laws within creation, the granting of free will delegates the ability to set parameters to the individual rather than to God. Free will introduces an element that transcends mere adherence to laws; it creates a unique anomaly beyond the scope of control by laws alone.

On one side of the spectrum of free will, we find attributes such as love, joy, peace, long-suffering, kindness, goodness, faith, gentleness, and self-control—the fruits of the spirit. These qualities operate independently of law because they harmonize with God's purpose and do not contradict the law of free will.

In contrast, sin surpasses the boundaries of the law, breaching the established order and purpose set by God. It represents a deviation from His will and introduces disharmony into creation.

But back to the main topic, I apologize for rambling on, you know I'm good at that(sorry).

Goodness, and the knowledge of it, was the only element of free will that creation had any comprehension of up until Satan created sin. Free will did not exist within the knowledge of creation until he sinned. Please read that carefully. I am not stating that free will did not exist within creation, it most certainly did, I am stating that the knowledge, or the full comprehension of it did not exist until the very first sin by Satan was committed, and by doing so established the law of free will within creation.

To illustrate, consider the speed of light again, and imagine that we do not know how fast it can go yet. Only until we can determine the velocity of the speed of light can we have the knowledge of the law that governs how fast it can go. If the velocity of the speed of light doesn't exist yet, we cannot determine what that law is. I hope you understand what I am saying.

Or ask yourself this, before creation did God exist? Obviously, we know he did, but do we have knowledge of it? Knowledge of God didn't exist until we were created. In the same manner, knowledge of free will could not exist until both good AND bad were created, for prior to the sin badness did not exist yet.

As I’ve stated in prior discussions, the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Bad represents the moment creation had knowledge of Good AND Bad, when Satan created sin. Essentially the tree could itself be called the Tree of Knowledge of Free Will, because up to the point of Satan's sin, creation only had a comprehension of good. Only until Satan demonstrated that sin, or badness, could be manifested did creation have knowledge of free wills existence.
 

BARNABY THE DOG.

Well-known member
You said "When Satan created sin, and now had knowledge of bad, end quote.
I think what you meant to say is that Satan initiated sin because the knowledge to do good or bad already existed
in Jehovah's Heavenly organization according to Genesis 3:22-B And Jehovah God went on to say: “Here the man has become like one of us in knowing good and bad,. Other than that I thought it was a good read thank you.
I never connected with that point! Amazing…all these years and I not once realised that! Always a choice. I wonder what the depth of knowing bad, that there was or how it could be described - or was it do you think, simply the knowledge that it exists in scientific terms perhaps, - just as we wonder about, for example the “God particle” and what it would mean to science - but not what the outcome would be. But then, death was not at that time a reality either was it? It poses a few questions - how complete was the knowledge of “bad” and how far reaching was its consequences if no one had ever invoked it?
 

BARNABY THE DOG.

Well-known member
Thank you for the kind words, I appreciate that. I actually did mean what I said, please allow me to elaborate a bit more to help you understand the perspective I am coming from.

The knowledge to do something is entirely different from the knowledge of actually doing it. Having an awareness of one's ability to act doesn't guarantee that the action will be taken, or that it can be, until it is enacted.

When it comes to creation knowing badness, It is impossible to know something that does not exist, and up until the time of the first sin badness did not exist within creation. The scripture you provide from Genesis is in the context of Jehovah talking to Jesus, the same as when he said "Let US make man in our image..."

Certainly Jehovah, and Jesus Christ as his master worker, both know good and bad, for they are the ones who set the standard for what is good and bad. You cannot set a standard for anything unless you first know the limits or boundaries in which to set it.

All aspects of creation adhere to a framework of standards and laws established by God, governing their existence within His intended purpose. Take, for example, the concept of time, which operates within its own set of standards and laws, enabling our existence. A simpler analogy can be found in the speed of light, which abides by the law that it cannot exceed 182,282 miles per second. Each element of creation operates within these established standards, with God's perfection serving as the ultimate benchmark. Thus, the laws governing existence are intricately aligned to ensure the perfection and order of creation. We have knowledge of these standards because they have been established as existing within creation through the observance of them.

Before sin entered into creation, the concept of the law of free will had not yet been established, nor had the consequences of breaking it been demonstrated. While God sets the standards and laws within creation, the granting of free will delegates the ability to set parameters to the individual rather than to God. Free will introduces an element that transcends mere adherence to laws; it creates a unique anomaly beyond the scope of control by laws alone.

On one side of the spectrum of free will, we find attributes such as love, joy, peace, long-suffering, kindness, goodness, faith, gentleness, and self-control—the fruits of the spirit. These qualities operate independently of law because they harmonize with God's purpose and do not contradict the law of free will.

In contrast, sin surpasses the boundaries of the law, breaching the established order and purpose set by God. It represents a deviation from His will and introduces disharmony into creation.

But back to the main topic, I apologize for rambling on, you know I'm good at that(sorry).

Goodness, and the knowledge of it, was the only element of free will that creation had any comprehension of up until Satan created sin. Free will did not exist within the knowledge of creation until he sinned. Please read that carefully. I am not stating that free will did not exist within creation, it most certainly did, I am stating that the knowledge, or the full comprehension of it did not exist until the very first sin by Satan was committed, and by doing so established the law of free will within creation.

To illustrate, consider the speed of light again, and imagine that we do not know how fast it can go yet. Only until we can determine the velocity of the speed of light can we have the knowledge of the law that governs how fast it can go. If the velocity of the speed of light doesn't exist yet, we cannot determine what that law is. I hope you understand what I am saying.

Or ask yourself this, before creation did God exist? Obviously, we know he did, but do we have knowledge of it? Knowledge of God didn't exist until we were created. In the same manner, knowledge of free will could not exist until both good AND bad were created, for prior to the sin badness did not exist yet.

As I’ve stated in prior discussions, the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Bad represents the moment creation had knowledge of Good AND Bad, when Satan created sin. Essentially the tree could itself be called the Tree of Knowledge of Free Will, because up to the point of Satan's sin, creation only had a comprehension of good. Only until Satan demonstrated that sin, or badness, could be manifested did creation have knowledge of free wills existence.
Interesting! That begs the question, does bad exist because good does? Does it rather, refer to a “standard”. This may be possible because Jehovah has moved within boundaries I assume. Take marriage for instance. Monogamy is the standard now, but concubines etc and multiple wives have also been tolerated if not permissible and then there was the “excused” use of a substitute partner for the production of a child with Sarah?
 

BARNABY THE DOG.

Well-known member
Thank you for the kind words, I appreciate that. I actually did mean what I said, please allow me to elaborate a bit more to help you understand the perspective I am coming from.

The knowledge to do something is entirely different from the knowledge of actually doing it. Having an awareness of one's ability to act doesn't guarantee that the action will be taken, or that it can be, until it is enacted.

When it comes to creation knowing badness, It is impossible to know something that does not exist, and up until the time of the first sin badness did not exist within creation. The scripture you provide from Genesis is in the context of Jehovah talking to Jesus, the same as when he said "Let US make man in our image..."

Certainly Jehovah, and Jesus Christ as his master worker, both know good and bad, for they are the ones who set the standard for what is good and bad. You cannot set a standard for anything unless you first know the limits or boundaries in which to set it.

All aspects of creation adhere to a framework of standards and laws established by God, governing their existence within His intended purpose. Take, for example, the concept of time, which operates within its own set of standards and laws, enabling our existence. A simpler analogy can be found in the speed of light, which abides by the law that it cannot exceed 182,282 miles per second. Each element of creation operates within these established standards, with God's perfection serving as the ultimate benchmark. Thus, the laws governing existence are intricately aligned to ensure the perfection and order of creation. We have knowledge of these standards because they have been established as existing within creation through the observance of them.

Before sin entered into creation, the concept of the law of free will had not yet been established, nor had the consequences of breaking it been demonstrated. While God sets the standards and laws within creation, the granting of free will delegates the ability to set parameters to the individual rather than to God. Free will introduces an element that transcends mere adherence to laws; it creates a unique anomaly beyond the scope of control by laws alone.

On one side of the spectrum of free will, we find attributes such as love, joy, peace, long-suffering, kindness, goodness, faith, gentleness, and self-control—the fruits of the spirit. These qualities operate independently of law because they harmonize with God's purpose and do not contradict the law of free will.

In contrast, sin surpasses the boundaries of the law, breaching the established order and purpose set by God. It represents a deviation from His will and introduces disharmony into creation.

But back to the main topic, I apologize for rambling on, you know I'm good at that(sorry).

Goodness, and the knowledge of it, was the only element of free will that creation had any comprehension of up until Satan created sin. Free will did not exist within the knowledge of creation until he sinned. Please read that carefully. I am not stating that free will did not exist within creation, it most certainly did, I am stating that the knowledge, or the full comprehension of it did not exist until the very first sin by Satan was committed, and by doing so established the law of free will within creation.

To illustrate, consider the speed of light again, and imagine that we do not know how fast it can go yet. Only until we can determine the velocity of the speed of light can we have the knowledge of the law that governs how fast it can go. If the velocity of the speed of light doesn't exist yet, we cannot determine what that law is. I hope you understand what I am saying.

Or ask yourself this, before creation did God exist? Obviously, we know he did, but do we have knowledge of it? Knowledge of God didn't exist until we were created. In the same manner, knowledge of free will could not exist until both good AND bad were created, for prior to the sin badness did not exist yet.

As I’ve stated in prior discussions, the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Bad represents the moment creation had knowledge of Good AND Bad, when Satan created sin. Essentially the tree could itself be called the Tree of Knowledge of Free Will, because up to the point of Satan's sin, creation only had a comprehension of good. Only until Satan demonstrated that sin, or badness, could be manifested did creation have knowledge of free wills existence.
The speed of light is also a standard and a constant, though it is affected by gravity and thus slowed, but it cannot go faster than its set boundary. If it did, then relativity would also be variable at the same point in time and that cannot happen as two objects cannot occupy the same space at the same time.
 

LuisMerino9412

Well-known member
Hi Cristo, I got a question regarding the quoted part. Bible says in Genesis 5:1 that Adam was created in the image of God alright, but Genesis 5:3 says When Adam was 130 years old, he had a son in his own likeness, after his own image; and he named him Seth. Does this mean that Adam wasn't in the image of God after he sinned? Can we as sinners be in the image of God? To me it implies that we, being removed from God by the sin, are now in the image of Adam. I'm thinking that by accepting Jesus' sacrifice and accepting his principles, we are given the opportunity to be brought back into the image of God.
Good question. Or maybe it refers that Seth was incredibly similar to Adam physically and in personality.
 

LuisMerino9412

Well-known member
We were created in God's image. An image is a reflection of something. Every choice we make is either a reflection of God's purpose, or it isn't. It is that simple. When the choice is in harmony with his purpose, we are reflecting back like we were created to, but when we don't reflect it, it is because the sin within us has prevented it. Sin blocks the reflection of love and creates death.

Because we were made in God's image, our very essence is endowed with the ability to create, in the fullest sense of the word. Everything you do is a creation, and I mean everything. You create subconsciously without even thinking about it. Your mind creates impulses to sustain life through the beating of the heart and taking of a breath, it is all done with a creation.

When you get up in the morning, you had to create the idea first and bring it to fruition by the action. You create the impulses in your mind first before any muscle moves in your body. You are creating right now by reading these words. Your eyes are creating nerve impulses that are sent to your brain to interpret them as sight. Your ears create impulses that your brain interprets as sounds. Every sense we have is a creation factory. I'm sure you get the point. Creation permeates every aspect of our existence. When we can no longer create anymore we die.

Of course, those creations are automatic; we don't need to think about them, they just create. We also have the ability to take our ideas and thoughts, which are a creation on a different level, and manifest them into existence. There is no limit to our creative abilities within this physical universe, for whatever it is we can think of, we can create it. Look around you, show me one thing that isn't created. We are creators, just as the God who created us to be in his image is.

“. . .Why, now there is nothing that they may have in mind to do that will be unattainable for them. . .” (Ge 11:6)​

This is where free will comes in. Free will is what gives us the ability to decide whether what we create is in line with God's purpose or isn't. God is the one who set the standard, and prior to the sin, all the angels used their free will to always create good. All they had knowledge of was good. They perfectly reflected back God's love by choosing to reflect his image back to him through their actions. It creates a homeostasis in which creation works for the survival of itself, and order is maintained to the glory of the creator. It's perfect.

Because its perfect, God expects perfection from his creation because they were created within it. Sin is the action of creating imperfection. It creates an imbalance and an entropy within creation, which is why it cannot be tolerated; it would destroy that which God created.

When Satan lied he was creating something that goes contrary to Gods purpose. Satan created sin, he is the manifester of it, and created something that did not exist prior. He is the father of it. He used his free will and chose to create something that cannot be sustained within a perfect environment; thus he is no longer perfect.

I am so thankful that we have a God that not only loves us so much that he created us, but that he understands that we cannot help but to create sin and offered us a way out. That he gave us a King, and redeemer of that imperfection, to eventually make us whole again, and to one day be able to only create that which is good, and loving, and sustaining for all eternity. I love Jehovah and his son Jesus Christ.
I've always thought that we might have abilities that many people consider as "magical" and that Jehovah forbids us to use because the demons are dangerous for us. But once we are in the new world we will be able to use them, maybe not all what we see today, but even more or things we do not know yet. Haha. Our brain and mind are a miracle and a huge mystery. We are small copies of Jehovah God and Jesus. So, we must have in some way the ability to communicate with and to see within the spiritual world and Jehovah's creation in general, but we are forbidden to do that because it is plagued with the demons. It's like going to a place that is beautiful and a mystery, but it's full of criminals. We are able in some way to do what Jehovah and Jesus do in a smaller scale, especially when we make groups. Imagine what all humanity will do once everyone is perfect. It's mind-blowing. Hehe. 😂😁🥰🤩😊
We might travel throughout the Universe or do things we could never imagine we might be able to do.
On the other hand, those abilities might be damaged because of sin and because we are imperfect. So, it's not the same. It's like a device or radio that does not work properly.
 
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Ana

Well-known member
El bien y el mal. Puede saber uno acerca del mal antes conocerlo? Porqué dice entonces Jehová que con solo pensar y desear hacer el mal ya estás pecando? Valora algo más que los actos? Parece que si. Hay una semejanza a Jehová en aquellos que le pertenecen, o dicho tambien en los que le obedecen. Obedecer a Jehová es lo bueno y uno puede tener libre albedrío y saber qué es lo malo aunque no lo conozca. Por ejemplo, y pido disculpas si el ejemplo es poco agradable, los niños que son abusados sexualmente. Esos niños tienen la inocencia de la experiencia y aún así, saben que lo que les hacen esta mal. Nadie se lo tiene que explicar. Lo saben y punto. Entonces si se puede saber lo que está mal sin conocerlo. Eso es una cualidad divina. Eso es estar hecho a su imagen y semejanza, por ejemplo.
 

Cristo

Well-known member
Interesting! That begs the question, does bad exist because good does? Does it rather, refer to a “standard”. This may be possible because Jehovah has moved within boundaries I assume. Take marriage for instance. Monogamy is the standard now, but concubines etc and multiple wives have also been tolerated if not permissible and then there was the “excused” use of a substitute partner for the production of a child with Sarah?

Well in a sense yes but let me explain.

Free will has two sides good/bad. Its that simple. Either we create for good, or we create for bad. For eons of time the angels always chose to create good, because that is our standard in creation. God knows his creation is good, he said that very thing. He also trusts that everything he designed will work flawlessly, just as he designed it to.

All the laws governing the fabric of time and space, spiritual and physical, are designed to operate flawlessly, adhering to the predetermined limits set for them. In considering free will, its predetermined limit was indeed the capacity to choose between creating good or creating bad. Both options represent the boundaries within which free will operates. Just as other foundational elements of creation function within their prescribed limits like time, light, gravity etc...etc, free will was likewise destined to operate within its defined parameters. Consequently, the existence of free will necessitates that eventually both good and bad choices would manifest within creation, as the boundaries were already predetermined when God established free will.

The last time I discussed this, I got banned, hopefully the words are more clear this time in what I am presenting. If Robert still thinks the same after reading, I will refrain from this line of thought on the forum.
 
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Cristo

Well-known member
I've always thought that we might have abilities that many people consider as "magical" and that Jehovah forbids us to use because the demons are dangerous for us. But once we are in the new world we will be able to use them, maybe not all what we see today, but even more or things we do not know yet. Haha. Our brain and mind are a miracle and a huge mystery. We are small copies of Jehovah God and Jesus. So, we must have in some way the ability to communicate with and to see within the spiritual world and Jehovah's creation in general, but we are forbidden to do that because it is plagued with the demons. It's like going to a place that is beautiful and a mystery, but it's full of criminals. We are able in some way to do what Jehovah and Jesus do in a smaller scale, especially when we make groups. Imagine what all humanity will do once everyone is perfect. It's mind-blowing. Hehe. 😂😁🥰🤩😊
We might travel throughout the Universe or do things we could never imagine we might be able to do.
On the other hand, those abilities might be damaged because of sin and because we are imperfect. So, it's not the same. It's like a device or radio that does not work properly.
Hi Luis, yes I've thought the same myself. If Jesus could walk on water because of faith, well then what is in store for us when we have perfected that faith. Oh my goodness, we cannot even comprehend our abilities...
 

Bk Kevin

Well-known member
El bien y el mal. Puede saber uno acerca del mal antes conocerlo? Porqué dice entonces Jehová que con solo pensar y desear hacer el mal ya estás pecando? Valora algo más que los actos? Parece que si. Hay una semejanza a Jehová en aquellos que le pertenecen, o dicho tambien en los que le obedecen. Obedecer a Jehová es lo bueno y uno puede tener libre albedrío y saber qué es lo malo aunque no lo conozca. Por ejemplo, y pido disculpas si el ejemplo es poco agradable, los niños que son abusados sexualmente. Esos niños tienen la inocencia de la experiencia y aún así, saben que lo que les hacen esta mal. Nadie se lo tiene que explicar. Lo saben y punto. Entonces si se puede saber lo que está mal sin conocerlo. Eso es una cualidad divina. Eso es estar hecho a su imagen y semejanza, por ejemplo.
Spanish to English...
Good and evil. Can one know about evil before knowing it? Why then does Jehovah say that just by thinking and desiring to do evil you are already sinning? Do you value something more than actions? It looks like it is. There is a resemblance to Jehovah in those who belong to him, or in other words in those who obey him. Obeying Jehovah is good and one can have free will and know what is bad even if one does not know it. For example, and I apologize if the example is unpleasant, children who are sexually abused. These children have the innocence of experience and yet, they know that what is done to them is wrong. Nobody has to explain it to you. They know it and that's it. So you can know what is wrong without knowing it. That is a divine quality. That is being made in his image and likeness, for example.
 
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