Stuck between Scripture and a hard place

BARNABY THE DOG.

Well-known member
BagdadBill and Nomex, thank you. I just had a conversation about this with my husband again and he said the following (him being the brains and I’m being the heart in this marriage, just like Jehovah made us 😉):

He says that the core, the basics, of the teachings of this org have taught us what we know today. And the basics are good; God is Almighty, his name is Jehovah, Jesus is His son who He sent to earth to die for our sins and Jesus will rule as king over Jehovah’s kingdom for 1000, together with the 144.000.

But as Br. King states the Jewish priest became corrupt, so did the Christians after Jesus’ death and so has the org in this time. Hubby says we need to wait for what is said in 1 Peter 4:17 “For it is the appointed time for the judgment to start with the house of God. Now if it starts first with us, what will the outcome be for those who are not obedient to the good news of God?” And my head gets this! When judgement starts the org will be cleansed, he says. And that makes sense to me.

Like Nomex we watch the meetings using Zoom as we refuse to wear masks. I haven’t wore one since this nonsense and I’m not about to start as the fibers get stuck in your lungs and will make millions ill. Also the oxygen levels in masks are 17,4% and anything under 19% is considered dangerous. But besides that, I feel like a hypocrite just logging in (I am typing this during our meeting, it’s 6PM here now). As I said, no one can make this decision for me and I respect my husband as head of the family so I’m not leaving without him. But my heart’s not in it.
Love it….typing on this site during a meeting….if anyone is ready to take hold of the truth it is you and your hubby sunshower!
 

Sunshower

Well-known member
It was a shock to me when I found that the GB were going along with the well documented covid SCAM. (anyone who would do a small amount of research would know better) Most people of all walks of life are walking right along with the lies. (and a large portion of those knowing it to be wrong, but believing the lie that it is "for the greater good".
A brother and sister told us that the GB is indeed going along but reveal their true nature later. How? When most brothers and sister are seriously ill or have died from the jab?

Have you visited e-watchman.com.?
Hi Barnaby, yes that is what brought me here 😊 I am well aware we must make our own decision “But there is accomplishment through many advisers.”
 

Driven

Well-known member
Sorry but in the beginning 5 of us took 2 hours to write a card to a sister’s cousin (she was very precise about what she didn’t want in there). That is 10 hours reported as field ministry, I felt like a total hypocrite.

Also our circle overseer told our elders that efficiency isn’t one of the fruitige of the spirit so half of the ministry is just “reconnecting” with brs and srs who we haven’t seen face to face in over a year.
Hi Sunshower, I see you are a “truth teller“. What you are describing as being hypocritical “preaching” when in fact it is more of a gab fest among the friends than anything else is how I experienced the telephone witnessing too. In fact, I couldn’t do it and at first, I just did the letter writing and telephone calling with my husband and I didn’t join in a group because I don’t do hypocrisy. If it was truly to get the preaching done, then it would only be in groups of 2 people max. Why do the rest of the friends just sit around listening? It makes no sense and does not contribute to preaching. Think about how Jehovah feels about it. We all need to just tell the truth and have a honest appraisal of what we are doing and why we are doing it. I still preach but informally and when I get a chance on this forum. I also feel that building up the friends is preaching. I no longer turn in my time and I am now inactive as far as the congregation is concerned. What helps me is to look at the pattern of the first century christians. They did not have elaborate time keeping and training.

Regarding Hebrews 10:24-25, I feel like coming to this forum to encourage each other, share scriptures and thoughts is doing that. I am delving into the ”meat” of the bible more than ever. I feel like I did when I first learned the truth. Scriptures that I have read before now have new meaning. Not many of the friends speak with me any longer except for one Elder’s wife. But when they do, I tell the truth about why I am not at the meetings and how I feel and why I feel this way. For me, that is witnessing to Jehovah’s righteousness because it is his principles that have led me here. I would recommend Robert King’s Book, “Jehovah Himself Has Become King, a primer for the apocalypse”. It’s on audio at https://jehovah-is-king.com/.

I really tried to go back to the meetings on Zoom but I just cannot for a couple of reasons. They are promoting lies, the mask being one huge lie. They have discarded so many scriptural principles such as not following commands of men and there are too many to list without writing a book. I realize that if it were not for the door to door work, I would not have come into the truth nor even have bible knowledge, but I give credit to Jehovah and his son for that. I also appreciate the brother and sister who made the sacrifices to teach me and the congregations that I was a part of that nourished me along the way. Again, the ultimate credit and glory goes to our heavenly Father, Jehovah.

There are so many scriptures that could apply but here is a very simple one, James 1:27: “The form of worship that is clean and undefiled from the standpoint of our God and Father is this: to look after orphans and widows in their tribulation, and to keep oneself without spot from the world“. Does that in any way describe the worship at the Kingdom Halls and on Zoom today? I guess you need to answer that for yourself. For me, I see the devastation that their push of the vaccines has done to the brotherhood, especially the vulnerable. They have not exempted anyone from this insanity, even the children and the widows. In fact they’ve made more widows with the vaccine push. The question that I answered for myself, is the form of worship clean and undefiled?

But truthfully, this is just how I feel and I don’t want to influence anyone else. I do give credit to those who can stay involved with the congregation and perhaps I am just not humble enough. I pray about it constantly, but I also have to protect my mental health and when I tried to return it was emotionally devastating to me, so I could not do it. If I forced myself I’m afraid I would say or do something inappropriate and I don’t want to let my upset cause me to sin.
 

BillyRay

Well-known member
Welcome Sunshower!!! I'm currently attending Zoom Meetings exclusively. I won't do the mask thing. It defies logic and strains credulity as far as I'm concerned. In my view - there's just no need for me to attend meetings at the Hall just to make a point - because the point is lost on them. So why put myself or my friends in the congregation at odds with each other over the mask? As we say in the business world... "The juice isn't worth the squeeze". When they remove the mask requirement, I will very likely return to the Kingdom Hall in person. Again, welcome.
 

David1982

Active member
I know we have to make the decision for ourselves but I’d like to know which one you choose and your motivation to do so. As the song says: Should I stay or should I go. I’d love to hear your comments.
We all have different circumstances and you'll find some of our stories and points of view here. To me personally, my conscience wouldn't allow me to turn a blind eye to the complicity of the organization with Satan's political system and the covidian lies, no matter the doctrine truth still there. Galatians 5:8, 9: 8 This sort of persuasion does not come from the One calling you. 9 A little leaven ferments the whole batch of dough.

Wasn't the whole point of being "in the truth", to always speak the truth, and defend it with zeal? Now defending the truth with zeal has become "having strong opinions that threaten our precious unity". If I returned to a Kingdom Hall, on Zoom or in person, I would have to speak up, and tell the brothers what I know to be the truth, about the duplicity and the harm being inflicted to them by the so-called channel. How many would be willing to listen? I would be labeled a troublemaker, and expelled from the synagogue as fast as I got in.

But that's just me, my blood boils fast, and it's probably better for everybody that I stay where I am :)

My parents are a bit in the same predicament as yours. They are retired in Portugal, and as far as they know, they are the only ones not vaccinated in their congregation. They're still on Zoom, but it's not the same thing anymore...
 

Sunshower

Well-known member
Hi Sunshower, I see you are a “truth teller“.
Yep, my husband calls me passionate 😂 It has brought me in a dire position many times, I can tell you that.

At the beginning of this scamdemic I tried to warn people. I sent a message with a video from a professor here in Holland to the elders and warned them about the (then coming) vaccine. The reply I got was: “I won’t and can’t do anything about it”. I’m still surprised that won’t came before can’t. In a zoom breakout room I was alone with two elders and their wives, I raised my serious concerns again and was told not to speak of it in the congregation so I wouldn’t upset the brothers and sisters.
I called the branch office in Emmen and got told that “the brothers lovingly guide us through the pandemic.” When I said pushing the vaccine would cause division, I got told this wasn’t possible! Then crickets 🦗

Well, it’s been over a year since that happened and look where we are now. Our congregation was “chosen” to give shelter to Ukrainian refugees, but only if you’re vaccinated. Want to help with building or renovating a hall? Only for the vaccinated! But division is impossible 😉🤦‍♀️🤮

I do “field work“ with a sister once a week but she puts her name under all letters. I cannot in good conscience sign my name. I can’t lead people to the organisation I can’t 100% agree with. Informal witnessing has always be my favourite cause I can tell people about Jehovah my way and not in a formula constructed for me. I am not a peddler of the word of God.

I still need to read Robert’s book. I only stumbled across his website a week ago and I’ve been absorbing all information like a sponge. Lucky for me, as English isn’t my first language (it’s not too shabby but religious English is quite different from conversational English) Paul Hettinga is kindly providing the Dutch people with translations of Robert’s articles (Thank you, Paul).

As for the vaccine, I have lost two uncles to the jab, two cousins have cancer and one had a heart attack. But it’s safe and effective, now shut up and wear your mask! 😷

As for influencing me, I need to make my own decision (and listen to my hubby 😉) plus I asked for everyone’s input. So no worries there.
 

4JahandChrist

Well-known member
Hi all,

This is my very first post here. I’m from The Netherlands and still a JW. But doctrines of The Watchtower organisation have been gnawing at me for a couple of years now (since child abuse came to light here, followed by the Covid madness). My husband and I are the only two people not vaxed in our congregation of over a hundred people as far as we’ve been able to determine. But the covidiocracy from the GB really pushed the limits of how far we can still trust them.

Not wanting to disobey Jehovah we find ourselves coming back to two verses in the Bible: Hebrews 10:25: “not forsaking our meeting together, as some have the custom, but encouraging one another, and all the more so as you see the day drawing near.” And Revelation 18:4: “And I heard another voice out of heaven say: “Get out of her, my people, if you do not want to share with her in her sins, and if you do not want to receive part of her plagues.”

I know we have to make the decision for ourselves but I’d like to know which one you choose and your motivation to do so. As the song says: Should I stay or should I go. I’d love to hear your comments.
Howdy Sunshower. Nice to see some Euro Blood on board. The Forum is mainly made up of Americans, America B ( Canadians) POMS (Brits) Random Australians (New Jerusalem) and Australia Lite ( New Zealanders). One or two from Cocaine Country (South America) . ......and last but not least a few stray hippies from Hawaii :cool:😉(y)

Back in February I made a Post in order to help Brothers to cope with the cognitive dissonance we are all experiencing with Covid and other issues. For me the whole Covid thing has been a total turd bomb....like the Global Elites took a gigantic dump on the planet and the mainstream nuffies have decided to rush to their nefarious poo pond and wallow in it.

The Three Technique is not meant as a cure all. It is simply a way of getting the Turd out of the Salad and still growing in appreciation of our Grand Creator and his Son.

I actually developed the technique when I was disassociated from the Org. I knew I still loved Jehovah and Christ and wanted to give the Truth another hurl so it was extremely helpful for me in getting reinstated and not getting swallowed up by some of the anti God ex JW community that has proliferated online.

Again welcome to the Forum. The Brothers have already given you some great feedback and I hope you can continue to contribute as you have great insight and analytical skills. Best wishes.

Maintain Joy and Perspective with the Three Column Technique.
 

4JahandChrist

Well-known member
This is brilliant and is kind of what my husband is telling me. Thank you for this, it’s very useful ❤️🥰
You're most welcome. I actually wrote it for both those who stay and also those who leave. If the decision is to leave we still must find a way to prove Satan a liar and continue to serve Jehovah in whatever circumstance we find ourselves. There is so much opposition to Jehovah by many of our Brothers that have fallen away. This Forum is a unique place as everyone is still firmly on the side of Jehovah regardless of what irrationality springs out of JW.ORG . Hard to find Brothers like that online but they are definitely here and they have a tremendous amount of insight and experience.
(y)
 

Sunshower

Well-known member
Hello Sunshower. Welcome to the forum. Here is a link to an article posted about 10 years ago before the pandemic, but I think it is still relevant.
Thank you, Robert. I’ve only just discovered your e-watchman sites (both the English and Dutch versions). I am trying to take it all in but wow, talk about an abundance of spiritual food (compared to the new Bible study “thing” - I can’t call it a book - we are now “studying“ at the Congregation Bible Study).
For years we’ve seen a decline in quality the org has been providing. We really have come to the level of milk now, I haven’t seen a Watchtower study I could sink my teeth into for a long time. While your articles have shown me things in the Bible I have read time and time again but clearly never understood. So I want to thank you for your work. I will continue to read your articles, like the Beroeans, carefully examining the Scriptures daily as to whether these things are so.
 

Nomex

Well-known member
Leave it Nomex to post the 3M respirator operating instructions.
You're dang right. ;) If these people refuse to read, I'm going to post their shame! The government was fining huge fines of tens of thousands of dollars to companies who didn't read and know this law, and they will jail you if you continue to ignore, that is they were doing this up until a month before Covid and had been enforcing this for 4 decades.

I use a respirator every day at work....and if I had done this to any "employee" they would fine me out of business.
 

LifeLearning

Well-known member
You're dang right. ;) If these people refuse to read, I'm going to post their shame! The government was fining huge fines of tens of thousands of dollars to companies who didn't read and know this law, and they will jail you if you continue to ignore, that is they were doing this up until a month before Covid and had been enforcing this for 4 decades.

I use a respirator every day at work....and if I had done this to any "employee" they would fine me out of business.
Also, any confined space that is to be worked in requires continuous monitoring of the oxygen level. The metering instrument is required to be equipped with an alarm that sounds any time the oxygen level is measured less than 19%.

This is LIFE SAFTEY, and required as Nomex points out by the occupational safety and health administration (OSHA).

Laws, Rules, Guidelines, Common Sense and just plain old Courtesy and Kindness have left the building. How can Jacob survive?
 

Asadour

Well-known member
@Sunshower WELCOME!!! I’m sorry i missed this before! I’m a bit slow on the uptake and my eye sight is bad.

Im Kim- I’m from the Pacific Northwest of the USA- I’ve been to your fine country many times- I have relatives in Den Haag- not JWs. I think of them often and worry so much about them.

I’m so happy you found your way to all these fine people on this forum, and e-watchman. It’s essential that you taken in as many of e-watchman’s essays and videos as possible- relearn the prophesies, perhaps learn many prophesies for the first time. When i began learning these truths, it was just exhilarating.

i think there is much fabulous, loving and scriptural advice mentioned here- lots of folks in your situation too.

My best recommendation is to pray often, Jehovah will not let you down. He will open up the way for you, and when he does you will know exactly what you need to do.

Don’t make hasty decisions (if possible- but sometimes we don’t have the luxury of time- my situation with the org did not allow for me to have the luxury of time, but that’s a story for another day)

I’m very glad you’re here. (-:

Much Love,

Kim
 
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Asadour

Well-known member
when in fact it is more of a gab fest among the friends than anything else
My experience was the exact same thing, @Driven.

Two hours of superficial conversation about the weather, knitting, sister populars’s new puppy- and 15 minutes of choosing a pre-written template for targeting an address or phone number (as opposed to targeting actual people) to preach to.

A complete mockery of Christ’s command to preach the good news of the Kingdom.

Does the Gov Body even suggest informal witnessing anymore or has that been discontinued too.
 
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