The loyalty test

Ireneo

Well-known member
Hello I will tell you how the story continues
A few days ago something diabolical happened to me
The elders of my congregation gave me a "loyalty test"
They gave me a letter to read in front of the brothers that encouraged them to get vaccinated
I had 5 minutes to do it
It was horrible pressure
I remembered Daniel and how they tried to catch him by putting him against God
I felt that if I read it I would become an idolater
I felt exactly the same as I felt at school 30 years ago
When I just started studying
They put me in front of the flag and asked me to sing the anthem
I refused but they started yelling at me
I felt that I would betray God and I stood my ground and I didn't.
This was the same for 30 years that I did not feel the pressure to idolatry
I told them I wouldn't do it as a matter of conscience
I'm not going to tell my brothers to get vaccinated
Be exposed since in report 10 brother Morris says "you have to get vaccinated"
It was a trap to expose me and catch me
It is clear that I disagree with the GB, there was no way out
Then I got to thinking why I felt like I would be an idol if I did that
I understood in a new way all this
The GB is demanding worship
It is undeniable is what I felt
It's a matter of faith
The brothers have fallen into idolatry
I remembered the Catholics who carry images
They are not necessarily bad and they think they worship God
But they adore him "through the image"
And if we criticize the image they get angry
GB supporters do the same
They attack whoever dares to disobey the gb
They worship God through him
I understood it in a new way
They told me that they would meet me to speak again 2 elders
At the meeting I decided to attack the matter intelligently
Make an argument they couldn't refute
I want to mention them because it was tested on the "battlefield" and they couldn't refute it
I base myself on the "neutrality" argument
I told them that the organization has been neutral in medical treatment for 70 years
This is based on not being master over anyone's faith and respecting individual rights
I told them that I have decided not to vaccinate
But I respect the decision of each one in this
My public position is not to recommend vaccination nor not vaccination
One thing or another
It is one thing to give information but another to recommend.
So I wouldn't push anyone to get vaccinated or not to get vaccinated
They tried to use fallacies and accuse me that my refusal was for not getting vaccinated
but they couldn't because I talked about neutrality
I want to maintain neutrality, I said
And I said that in report 10 the organization abandoned neutrality
they turned green
But I explained
Telling the brothers "get vaccinated" is taking sides
To take sides is to leave neutrality
I did not change, I am the same as 30 years ago
The organization changed
They had to admit
then i said
we are facing a doctrinal change
a new light
The brothers will now recommend vaccination
Before report 10, if someone did it, we corrected them for not being neutral.
After report 10 that changed
I asked them
What is the basis for doctrinal change?
Why was the neutral stance abandoned on medical issues?
They had to admit that no arguments were provided
So they told me that I should accept it because sometimes illogical things are said and they read me the watchtower
They said we don't have all the data
I told them no
that doesn't apply
The GB when making DOCTRINAL decisions is based on the bible
An ADMINISTRATIVE decision is not the same as a DOCTRINAL decision
the GB cannot make a decision and say
"the decision was based on the bible but I can't show you the biblical arguments that support it"
The bible that I have is the same as the GB
So I want the arguments on which the "new light" is based.
An elder must adhere "to the faithful word when teaching"
The GB is obliged to show me the biblical arguments to rule out vaccine neutrality
They accused me of mistrusting the GB and trying to understand
I said I can't understand what I don't know
I'm not stupid they just didn't show the argument why I should abandon neutrality
I just don't know why now I have to be partisan on a controversial issue
So my position will be neutrality until they show me the opposite with the bible.
My bible-educated conscience tells me to be neutral

They got very upset and scheduled a meeting with all the elders with me.
I think they want to destroy me
The key is to make the following clear
Neutrality in medical matters is biblical
It has been our position for decades
If it changes it is a doctrinal change
The GB is obliged to substantiate the doctrinal change with the bible
If you don't show it I'm not obligated to change

You have to hold on to that like a bulldog and don't let go until they bleed out.
They try to use fallacies that accuse us of bad motivations, apostasy, distrust, being anti-vaccine, etc.
But if one clings to neutrality they lose the debate
I wanted to share it with you maybe it will help you
They cannot even destroy neutrality by claiming that governments ask for it
Christ said "give Caesar's to Caesar and God's to God."
If God asks for neutrality, it doesn't matter what the government says.
The neutrality argument is indestructible

I tell you in case you have to face "the loyalty test"
Satan doesn't change
The one who did not light incense in front of the altar to the emperor ended up eaten by the beasts
 
Last edited:
Hello I will tell you how the story continues
A few days ago something diabolical happened to me
The elders of my congregation gave me a "loyalty test"
They gave me a letter to read in front of the brothers that encouraged them to get vaccinated
I had 5 minutes to do it
It was horrible pressure
I remembered Daniel and how they tried to catch him by putting him against God
I felt that if I read it I would become an idolater
I felt exactly the same as I felt at school 30 years ago
When I just started studying
They put me in front of the flag and asked me to sing the anthem
I refused but they started yelling at me
I felt that I would betray God and I stood my ground and I didn't.
This was the same for 30 years that I did not feel the pressure to idolatry
I told them I wouldn't do it as a matter of conscience
I'm not going to tell my brothers to get vaccinated
Be exposed since in report 10 brother Morris says "you have to get vaccinated"
It was a trap to expose me and catch me
It is clear that I disagree with the GB, there was no way out
Then I got to thinking why I felt like I would be an idol if I did that
I understood in a new way all this
The GB is demanding worship
It is undeniable is what I felt
It's a matter of faith
The brothers have fallen into idolatry
I remembered the Catholics who carry images
They are not necessarily bad and they think they worship God
But they adore him "through the image"
And if we criticize the image they get angry
GB supporters do the same
They attack whoever dares to disobey the gb
They worship God through him
I understood it in a new way
They told me that they would meet me to speak again 2 elders
At the meeting I decided to attack the matter intelligently
Make an argument they couldn't refute
I want to mention them because it was tested on the "battlefield" and they couldn't refute it
I base myself on the "neutrality" argument
I told them that the organization has been neutral in medical treatment for 70 years
This is based on not being master over anyone's faith and respecting individual rights
I told them that I have decided not to vaccinate
But I respect the decision of each one in this
My public position is not to recommend vaccination nor not vaccination
One thing or another
It is one thing to give information but another to recommend.
So I wouldn't push anyone to get vaccinated or not to get vaccinated
They tried to use fallacies and accuse me that my refusal was for not getting vaccinated
but they couldn't because I talked about neutrality
I want to maintain neutrality, I said
And I said that in report 10 the organization abandoned neutrality
they turned green
But I explained
Telling the brothers "get vaccinated" is taking sides
To take sides is to leave neutrality
I did not change, I am the same as 30 years ago
The organization changed
They had to admit
then i said
we are facing a doctrinal change
a new light
The brothers will now recommend vaccination
Before report 10, if someone did it, we corrected them for not being neutral.
After report 10 that changed
I asked them
What is the basis for doctrinal change?
Why was the neutral stance abandoned on medical issues?
They had to admit that no arguments were provided
So they told me that I should accept it because sometimes illogical things are said and they read me the watchtower
They said we don't have all the data
I told them no
that doesn't apply
The GB when making DOCTRINAL decisions is based on the bible
An ADMINISTRATIVE decision is not the same as a DOCTRINAL decision
the GB cannot make a decision and say
"the decision was based on the bible but I can't show you the biblical arguments that support it"
The bible that I have is the same as the GB
So I want the arguments on which the "new light" is based.
An elder must adhere "to the faithful word when teaching"
The GB is obliged to show me the biblical arguments to rule out vaccine neutrality
They accused me of mistrusting the GB and trying to understand
I said I can't understand what I don't know
I'm not stupid they just didn't show the argument why I should abandon neutrality
I just don't know why now I have to be partisan on a controversial issue
So my position will be neutrality until they show me the opposite with the bible.
My bible-educated conscience tells me to be neutral

They got very upset and scheduled a meeting with all the elders with me.
I think they want to destroy me
The key is to make the following clear
Neutrality in medical matters is biblical
It has been our position for decades
If it changes it is a doctrinal change
The GB is obliged to substantiate the doctrinal change with the bible
If you don't show it I'm not obligated to change

You have to hold on to that like a bulldog and don't let go until they bleed out.
They try to use fallacies that accuse us of bad motivations, apostasy, distrust, being anti-vaccine, etc.
But if one clings to neutrality they lose the debate
I wanted to share it with you maybe it will help you
They cannot even destroy neutrality by claiming that governments ask for it
Christ said "give Caesar's to Caesar and God's to God."
If God asks for neutrality, it doesn't matter what the government says.
The neutrality argument is indestructible

I tell you in case you have to face "the loyalty test"
Satan doesn't change
The one who did not light incense in front of the altar to the emperor ended up eaten by the beasts
👏 👏 👏 🫂 May Jehovah look after you as he did Daniel in the lion's den.
 
That was AWESOME Ireneo, beautiful in its simplicity and logic, as truth always is. No doubt in defending your beliefs you must have felt the same as Paul did when he was doing the same thing. “. . .Now as he was saying these things in his defense, Festus said in a loud voice: “You are going mad, Paul! Great learning is driving you into madness!” 25 But Paul said: “I am not going mad, Your Excellency Festus, but I am uttering sayings of truth and of soundness of mind.” Ac 26:24-25
 
Hello I will tell you how the story continues
A few days ago something diabolical happened to me
The elders of my congregation gave me a "loyalty test"
They gave me a letter to read in front of the brothers that encouraged them to get vaccinated
I had 5 minutes to do it
It was horrible pressure
I remembered Daniel and how they tried to catch him by putting him against God
I felt that if I read it I would become an idolater
I felt exactly the same as I felt at school 30 years ago
When I just started studying
They put me in front of the flag and asked me to sing the anthem
I refused but they started yelling at me
I felt that I would betray God and I stood my ground and I didn't.
This was the same for 30 years that I did not feel the pressure to idolatry
I told them I wouldn't do it as a matter of conscience
I'm not going to tell my brothers to get vaccinated
Be exposed since in report 10 brother Morris says "you have to get vaccinated"
It was a trap to expose me and catch me
It is clear that I disagree with the GB, there was no way out
Then I got to thinking why I felt like I would be an idol if I did that
I understood in a new way all this
The GB is demanding worship
It is undeniable is what I felt
It's a matter of faith
The brothers have fallen into idolatry
I remembered the Catholics who carry images
They are not necessarily bad and they think they worship God
But they adore him "through the image"
And if we criticize the image they get angry
GB supporters do the same
They attack whoever dares to disobey the gb
They worship God through him
I understood it in a new way
They told me that they would meet me to speak again 2 elders
At the meeting I decided to attack the matter intelligently
Make an argument they couldn't refute
I want to mention them because it was tested on the "battlefield" and they couldn't refute it
I base myself on the "neutrality" argument
I told them that the organization has been neutral in medical treatment for 70 years
This is based on not being master over anyone's faith and respecting individual rights
I told them that I have decided not to vaccinate
But I respect the decision of each one in this
My public position is not to recommend vaccination nor not vaccination
One thing or another
It is one thing to give information but another to recommend.
So I wouldn't push anyone to get vaccinated or not to get vaccinated
They tried to use fallacies and accuse me that my refusal was for not getting vaccinated
but they couldn't because I talked about neutrality
I want to maintain neutrality, I said
And I said that in report 10 the organization abandoned neutrality
they turned green
But I explained
Telling the brothers "get vaccinated" is taking sides
To take sides is to leave neutrality
I did not change, I am the same as 30 years ago
The organization changed
They had to admit
then i said
we are facing a doctrinal change
a new light
The brothers will now recommend vaccination
Before report 10, if someone did it, we corrected them for not being neutral.
After report 10 that changed
I asked them
What is the basis for doctrinal change?
Why was the neutral stance abandoned on medical issues?
They had to admit that no arguments were provided
So they told me that I should accept it because sometimes illogical things are said and they read me the watchtower
They said we don't have all the data
I told them no
that doesn't apply
The GB when making DOCTRINAL decisions is based on the bible
An ADMINISTRATIVE decision is not the same as a DOCTRINAL decision
the GB cannot make a decision and say
"the decision was based on the bible but I can't show you the biblical arguments that support it"
The bible that I have is the same as the GB
So I want the arguments on which the "new light" is based.
An elder must adhere "to the faithful word when teaching"
The GB is obliged to show me the biblical arguments to rule out vaccine neutrality
They accused me of mistrusting the GB and trying to understand
I said I can't understand what I don't know
I'm not stupid they just didn't show the argument why I should abandon neutrality
I just don't know why now I have to be partisan on a controversial issue
So my position will be neutrality until they show me the opposite with the bible.
My bible-educated conscience tells me to be neutral

They got very upset and scheduled a meeting with all the elders with me.
I think they want to destroy me
The key is to make the following clear
Neutrality in medical matters is biblical
It has been our position for decades
If it changes it is a doctrinal change
The GB is obliged to substantiate the doctrinal change with the bible
If you don't show it I'm not obligated to change

You have to hold on to that like a bulldog and don't let go until they bleed out.
They try to use fallacies that accuse us of bad motivations, apostasy, distrust, being anti-vaccine, etc.
But if one clings to neutrality they lose the debate
I wanted to share it with you maybe it will help you
They cannot even destroy neutrality by claiming that governments ask for it
Christ said "give Caesar's to Caesar and God's to God."
If God asks for neutrality, it doesn't matter what the government says.
The neutrality argument is indestructible

I tell you in case you have to face "the loyalty test"
Satan doesn't change
The one who did not light incense in front of the altar to the emperor ended up eaten by the beasts
Perhaps this is why they kept pushing that line about trusting God's channel even if they tell you to do something that makes no sense. I suspect the pressure will escalate. PS: Was all that stuff happening in person or did it all take place on Zoom?
 
Perhaps this is why they kept pushing that line about trusting God's channel even if they tell you to do something that makes no sense. I suspect the pressure will escalate. PS: Was all that stuff happening in person or did it all take place on Zoom?
Hello Maskita
She went on a zoom meeting while she was in front of everyone
it was wicked
They did it to expose me
There was not way to get out
I think many others will begin to experience similar things
it's about staining our "Christian clothes"
 
Just think, you may be one of the first of many to have the honor of being thrown out of the synagogue for the sake of Jesus. Stand firm!
It's true
They were building everything until they reached report 10
from now on "laws" will be derived from the morris declaration
This will trigger a chase towards the unvaccinated
everyone who does not get vaccinated will be marked as a little spiritual and disobedient brother
 
Hello I will tell you how the story continues
A few days ago something diabolical happened to me
The elders of my congregation gave me a "loyalty test"
They gave me a letter to read in front of the brothers that encouraged them to get vaccinated
I had 5 minutes to do it
It was horrible pressure
I remembered Daniel and how they tried to catch him by putting him against God
I felt that if I read it I would become an idolater
I felt exactly the same as I felt at school 30 years ago
When I just started studying
They put me in front of the flag and asked me to sing the anthem
I refused but they started yelling at me
I felt that I would betray God and I stood my ground and I didn't.
This was the same for 30 years that I did not feel the pressure to idolatry
I told them I wouldn't do it as a matter of conscience
I'm not going to tell my brothers to get vaccinated
Be exposed since in report 10 brother Morris says "you have to get vaccinated"
It was a trap to expose me and catch me
It is clear that I disagree with the GB, there was no way out
Then I got to thinking why I felt like I would be an idol if I did that
I understood in a new way all this
The GB is demanding worship
It is undeniable is what I felt
It's a matter of faith
The brothers have fallen into idolatry
I remembered the Catholics who carry images
They are not necessarily bad and they think they worship God
But they adore him "through the image"
And if we criticize the image they get angry
GB supporters do the same
They attack whoever dares to disobey the gb
They worship God through him
I understood it in a new way
They told me that they would meet me to speak again 2 elders
At the meeting I decided to attack the matter intelligently
Make an argument they couldn't refute
I want to mention them because it was tested on the "battlefield" and they couldn't refute it
I base myself on the "neutrality" argument
I told them that the organization has been neutral in medical treatment for 70 years
This is based on not being master over anyone's faith and respecting individual rights
I told them that I have decided not to vaccinate
But I respect the decision of each one in this
My public position is not to recommend vaccination nor not vaccination
One thing or another
It is one thing to give information but another to recommend.
So I wouldn't push anyone to get vaccinated or not to get vaccinated
They tried to use fallacies and accuse me that my refusal was for not getting vaccinated
but they couldn't because I talked about neutrality
I want to maintain neutrality, I said
And I said that in report 10 the organization abandoned neutrality
they turned green
But I explained
Telling the brothers "get vaccinated" is taking sides
To take sides is to leave neutrality
I did not change, I am the same as 30 years ago
The organization changed
They had to admit
then i said
we are facing a doctrinal change
a new light
The brothers will now recommend vaccination
Before report 10, if someone did it, we corrected them for not being neutral.
After report 10 that changed
I asked them
What is the basis for doctrinal change?
Why was the neutral stance abandoned on medical issues?
They had to admit that no arguments were provided
So they told me that I should accept it because sometimes illogical things are said and they read me the watchtower
They said we don't have all the data
I told them no
that doesn't apply
The GB when making DOCTRINAL decisions is based on the bible
An ADMINISTRATIVE decision is not the same as a DOCTRINAL decision
the GB cannot make a decision and say
"the decision was based on the bible but I can't show you the biblical arguments that support it"
The bible that I have is the same as the GB
So I want the arguments on which the "new light" is based.
An elder must adhere "to the faithful word when teaching"
The GB is obliged to show me the biblical arguments to rule out vaccine neutrality
They accused me of mistrusting the GB and trying to understand
I said I can't understand what I don't know
I'm not stupid they just didn't show the argument why I should abandon neutrality
I just don't know why now I have to be partisan on a controversial issue
So my position will be neutrality until they show me the opposite with the bible.
My bible-educated conscience tells me to be neutral

They got very upset and scheduled a meeting with all the elders with me.
I think they want to destroy me
The key is to make the following clear
Neutrality in medical matters is biblical
It has been our position for decades
If it changes it is a doctrinal change
The GB is obliged to substantiate the doctrinal change with the bible
If you don't show it I'm not obligated to change

You have to hold on to that like a bulldog and don't let go until they bleed out.
They try to use fallacies that accuse us of bad motivations, apostasy, distrust, being anti-vaccine, etc.
But if one clings to neutrality they lose the debate
I wanted to share it with you maybe it will help you
They cannot even destroy neutrality by claiming that governments ask for it
Christ said "give Caesar's to Caesar and God's to God."
If God asks for neutrality, it doesn't matter what the government says.
The neutrality argument is indestructible

I tell you in case you have to face "the loyalty test"
Satan doesn't change
The one who did not light incense in front of the altar to the emperor ended up eaten by the beasts
wow bro!!! I wanted to clap when I read your experience, but I didn't want to wake up my family who are already asleep.

He has scored a goal for the entire squad!!! That's how it's done. God has given him wisdom to face the situation. This is no time to be cowards.

I don't think they'll expel him for that, but he'll surely no longer qualify as an elder and they'll discharge him.

If that happens, then better. At this time it is not convenient for you to become an accomplice by being part of a body of idolatrous elders, and who are damaging the flock with those diabolical punctures.

God bless you brother!!
 
Brother Ireneo, you are on 100% Scriptural grounds. No man, including the Governing Body, has the right to impel us to violate our Christian conscience.

"Let the one eating not look down on the one not eating, and let the one not eating not judge the one eating. Who are you to judge the servant of another? To his own master he stands or falls. Indeed, he will be made to stand, for Jehovah can make him stand." (Romans 14:3,4)

Jehovah and Jesus will bless you for you faithful stand. You are in my prayers brother. You can sleep with a clear conscience.
 
It's true
They were building everything until they reached report 10
from now on "laws" will be derived from the morris declaration
This will trigger a chase towards the unvaccinated
everyone who does not get vaccinated will be marked as a little spiritual and disobedient brother
Hey Ireneo! Man talk about tense! You have to do what you have to do! If the judicial committee is formed I highly advise recording the meeting just in case you need it. Depending on where it all goes you may even have to get a bit "hellfire damnation" preachy if there is no more reasoning from the elders. You may have to lay judgments on them like Stephen did in the Sanhedrin when he couldn't reason with the Pharisees anymore.
 
Brother I applaud your courage and loyalty to Jehovah!

I am going to take notes because I think each one of us associated with the organization who is standing firm on this issue will eventually be forced to make a defense before the brothers.

My brother was put in a similar situation. He was meeting chairman and was supposed to read the letter encouraging the injections. He told the coordinator he would not read it. The coordinator agreed to read it, but everyone understood why he did not read it. He was not counseled, but he told them he could no longer serve, and he stepped down.

In my research I found this w15 9/15 pp. 8-12 article I thought might be helpful to show the brothers what the WT has said regarding health and matters of conscience and ask them to show me from the Bible why the advice is now to mandate experimental medical procedures regardless of individual health concerns.
 

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Brother I applaud your courage and loyalty to Jehovah!

I am going to take notes because I think each one of us associated with the organization who is standing firm on this issue will eventually be forced to make a defense before the brothers.

My brother was put in a similar situation. He was meeting chairman and was supposed to read the letter encouraging the injections. He told the coordinator he would not read it. The coordinator agreed to read it, but everyone understood why he did not read it. He was not counseled, but he told them he could no longer serve, and he stepped down.

In my research I found this w15 9/15 pp. 8-12 article I thought might be helpful to show the brothers what the WT has said regarding health and matters of conscience and ask them to show me from the Bible why the advice is now to mandate experimental medical procedures regardless of individual health concerns.
If the elders push this then we should push "Raflexidine" on them. Lol
 
Brother I applaud your courage and loyalty to Jehovah!

I am going to take notes because I think each one of us associated with the organization who is standing firm on this issue will eventually be forced to make a defense before the brothers.

My brother was put in a similar situation. He was meeting chairman and was supposed to read the letter encouraging the injections. He told the coordinator he would not read it. The coordinator agreed to read it, but everyone understood why he did not read it. He was not counseled, but he told them he could no longer serve, and he stepped down.

In my research I found this w15 9/15 pp. 8-12 article I thought might be helpful to show the brothers what the WT has said regarding health and matters of conscience and ask them to show me from the Bible why the advice is now to mandate experimental medical procedures regardless of individual health concerns.
wow that article is amazing, isn’t it! The GB is so short sighted it doesn’t even remember what it signed off on just a few years back?

@Ireneo this article is for you!

What a great find @MuleJule
 
Brother I applaud your courage and loyalty to Jehovah!

I am going to take notes because I think each one of us associated with the organization who is standing firm on this issue will eventually be forced to make a defense before the brothers.

My brother was put in a similar situation. He was meeting chairman and was supposed to read the letter encouraging the injections. He told the coordinator he would not read it. The coordinator agreed to read it, but everyone understood why he did not read it. He was not counseled, but he told them he could no longer serve, and he stepped down.

In my research I found this w15 9/15 pp. 8-12 article I thought might be helpful to show the brothers what the WT has said regarding health and matters of conscience and ask them to show me from the Bible why the advice is now to mandate experimental medical procedures regardless of individual health concerns.
That is what is so stunning about all this.
Here is the April 2021 announcement:



3. Personal Decisions During the Pandemic: In some parts of the world, governments
have begun to make COVID-19 vaccines available to the public. Whether someone chooses
to be vaccinated is a personal decision. (Gal. 6:5) Thus, it would be loving to respect the personal
decision that each individual makes based on his Bible-trained conscience, instead of
pressuring someone to make the same choice that we made.

They clearly sold out. The Governing Body have gone directly against this counsel they gave, which was Bible based. And now they expect all the elders to violate the Bible by pressuring on a matter of personal choice. It is stunning how many elders have placed the Governing Body above what the Bible clearly teaches. Even when it is clearly pointed out to them, the cognitive dissonance is so intense that they support the GB even with no Biblical support. It is clearly over now. Just a train wreck. The GB has no way to walk this back. They have dug a hole they cannot escape from.
 
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