What are we reading đź“š

The God Pill

Well-known member
Starting to read the high priest book I have to say while obviously there are a few things all of us would disagree with her on Barker really shows her work 1/4 if the pages are footnotes and list and commentary on/of primary and secondary sources multiple individual chapters have 120+ notes in the back.
 

The God Pill

Well-known member
Almost finished reading "the acts of John" (circa 150-250 AD) it's docetic gnostic trinitarian garbage that includes the hellfire doctrine and subtly the same gnostic anti procreation attitude of "acts of thomas" that said many stories before it starts unloading apostate doctrine are humorous. Outside the gnostic stuff two things about it stand out one there is a human character that almost comits necrophilia that is labeled a messenger of Satan suggesting that in the second or third century the angel/messenger of Satan that slapped Paul was understood as a human second Mammon is identified in it as an evil spirit which would mean the notion of mammon referring to an entity goes at least as far back to just a century or two after the apostles
 

BARNABY THE DOG.

Well-known member
Almost finished reading "the acts of John" (circa 150-250 AD) it's docetic gnostic trinitarian garbage that includes the hellfire doctrine and subtly the same gnostic anti procreation attitude of "acts of thomas" that said many stories before it starts unloading apostate doctrine are humorous. Outside the gnostic stuff two things about it stand out one there is a human character that almost comits necrophilia that is labeled a messenger of Satan suggesting that in the second or third century the angel/messenger of Satan that slapped Paul was understood as a human second Mammon is identified in it as an evil spirit which would mean the notion of mammon referring to an entity goes at least as far back to just a century or two after the apostles
I have not devoted much time to reading “docetic gnostic trinitarian garbage”, it has to be said, but it’s certainly a beautiful phrase that has a multitudinal if not universal application to so many religious teachings that I shall doubtless have much enjoyment in using such a descriptive gem in the future - if you don’t mind my plagiarising your descriptive genius that is!
 

White Stone

Well-known member
@White Stone I've been meaning to ask your takes on 1 and 2 Clement
Was he the Clement of Alexandria? I’ve not yet finished the first book of the Ante-Nicene Fathers, I’m stuck yet at Iraeneus because of his introduction about the gnosticism, can’t comprehend much there.

What is the name of the book specifically? Insaw three books about Exhortation, Instructor and Stromata.
 
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The God Pill

Well-known member
Was he the Clement of Alexandria? I’ve not yet finished the first book of the Ante-Nicene Fathers, I’m stuck yet at Iraeneus because of his introduction about the gnosticism, can’t comprehend much there.

What is the name of the book specifically? Insaw three books about Exhortation, Instructor and Stromata.
Clement of Rome. I did skim through Clement of Alexandria's stromata a couple months ago though.
 

White Stone

Well-known member
Clement of Rome. I did skim through Clement of Alexandria's stromata a couple months ago though.
Just finished reading both. The 1st letter of Clement focused on admonishing and exhorting the Corinthians.

There were mostly truths, but there were examples he used that is not true like the phoenix in chapter 25.

Then on Chapter 39, he quoted the words of Job’s unfaithful friends as if truth like in Job 4:16-21;5:1-5; 15:15.(Job 42:7)

His 2nd letter is not in the same volume of Ante-Nicene Fathers Book Volume 1. Searched for it online, and read that it was later written by a different author that is attributed it to other Clement of later time. His first sentence and in the middle part of his letter about the Christ does reflect the teaching of later Christians if understood not in the way as God’s exact image.

This part though raised a red flag on me. Making almsgiving as a way to lighten or repent from their sin.
Almsgiving therefore is a good thing, as repentance from sin; fasting is better than prayer, but almsgiving than both; “but love covereth a multitude of sins.” (1Pe 4:8. Comp. Pro 10:12; Jas 5:20.) But prayer out of a good conscience delivereth from death. Blessed is every one that is found full of these; for alms-giving lighteneth the burden of sin.

What are your takes on these two letters?
 

StopTheInsanity

Well-known member
Boy have I found my tribe. I have so many books I am reading that I'd get writer's cramp just trying to type it all out. So much to learn and unlearn. It's all so paradigm changing when you learn the "Paul Harvey's Rest of the Story" version of what really went on versus the narrative the elites taught us in grade school. So much good nuggets out there and yes, not enough time in the day but you do find time if you switch of the TV which I did 15 years ago.
 

StopTheInsanity

Well-known member
The book Antiquities of the Jews Book 1 Chapter 1 pr. 4 reads:


Just a speculation, but could it be the reason that Noah was able to communicate with the animals back then and have them in the ark, and even command the birds to fly to look for a land?
Sounds a lot like a point that I was trying to make in another thread on here....
 

The God Pill

Well-known member
Just finished reading both. The 1st letter of Clement focused on admonishing and exhorting the Corinthians.

There were mostly truths, but there were examples he used that is not true like the phoenix in chapter 25.

Then on Chapter 39, he quoted the words of Job’s unfaithful friends as if truth like in Job 4:16-21;5:1-5; 15:15.(Job 42:7)

His 2nd letter is not in the same volume of Ante-Nicene Fathers Book Volume 1. Searched for it online, and read that it was later written by a different author that is attributed it to other Clement of later time. His first sentence and in the middle part of his letter about the Christ does reflect the teaching of later Christians if understood not in the way as God’s exact image.

This part though raised a red flag on me. Making almsgiving as a way to lighten or repent from their sin.


What are your takes on these two letters?
In work prep so I'll have to break my answer into a few parts today. On 1 Clement its been a year or two since I've read it so my memory isn't fresh but the impression I had was that while not scripture it's clear not even Clement would have viewed it as scripture it's nice because he very seldom relies on his own authority opting to use the scriptures a ton. On the phoenix part while the myths associated with the phoenix are probably fictional he would have probably seen it as appropriate to reference the creature because the word phoenix shows up in the septuagint version of Job.

On 2 Clement obviously it's not by him but a transcript of a speech of one of his successors in the second half of the second century what I found interesting about it outside the moral exhortation was that it seemed to reference the two hopes as different points a heavenly ressurection and a bodily ressurection which would make sense as I seem to remember Iraneus showing an awareness of the two hopes at some point in the second half of Against Heresies likewise in the second half of the second century.

I'll respond on the almsgiving part when I'm on break at work.
 

The God Pill

Well-known member
Targum of psalms 23 thought it was interesting because it mentions mannah

Psalm 23
1. A psalm of David. It is the Lord who fed his people in the wilderness; they did not lack anything.

2. In a place of thirst he will settle me in pleasant grass; he led me to the waters of rest.

3. He will restore my soul with manna;[139] he led me in the paths of righteousness[140] for the sake of his name.[141]

4. Indeed, when I go into exile by the plain of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil; for your word is my help, your straight staff and your Torah, they will comfort me.

5. You have set before me a high table of manna in front of my oppressors; you have fattened my body with stuffed fowl, and with anointing oil the heads of my priests; my goblet is wide.

6. Indeed grace and favor will follow me all the days of my life, while I sit in the sanctuary of the Lord for length of days.
 
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