Adam and Eve question

SkinnyAndShort

SkinnyAndShort

Well-known member
Are there scriptures to show there is not going to be a resurrection for Adam and Eve ? Or is it assumed since they started off perfect and failed that they lose out on life forever?
 
Not that it would actually be like this... But imagine if Adam and Eve were resurrected. There would be billions of people with a bone to pick with them - me included. Anyhow... that type of thing is way above my spiritual pay grade. I'll leave such decisions in Jehovah's hands.

However.... I did find a cool Watchtower article from 1965 that addressed this. Here are a couple paragraphs, and their conclusion. (Of course, the light could have gotten brighter on this topic since then. If so, I'm not aware of it.)

Because Adam - despite God’s full warning - willfully brought death upon all his offspring, he was a willful murderer, and Eve shared with him in this willful transgression. So Jehovah, acting in harmony with his later law concerning the Israelite “cities of refuge,” would refuse to accept any ransom in Adam’s behalf and in Eve’s behalf, not letting them come under the ministration of his High Priest Jesus Christ. But as regards the human family that descended from them, God could justly accept the ransom sacrifice of his High Priest Jesus Christ in their behalf, because their sinfulness that merited death was only accidental, it not being willed by them but being due only to birth from Adam.

What about the ransom benefits and Cain the son of Adam?

In the case of Cain, the first son of Adam, God justly withholds the benefits of Christ’s ransom sacrifice from Cain because Jehovah God directly warned Cain and yet he wickedly assassinated his godly brother Abel. For Cain as well as for his parents Adam and Eve we reasonably expect no resurrection from the dead.
 
So I’m a sense their choosing to believe satan over Jehovah was their “mark of the beast” being that they started off perfect. W_stone makes a decent point that love is greater than the law.
 
No they will not be resurrected. One of the reasons the Bible calls Jesus the second Adam, is because Jesus also sacrificed is ability to have children his "seed". Jesus adopted Adam's children. The only way we are able to benefit from his sacrifice. Adam and Eve by being disobedient also sacrificed their seed by passing on sin and death.
 
Nomex said:
BTW, if Jesus had had children and they had remained faithful, then all of Adam's children would not be able to be redeemed.
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That is an interesting thought. I remember discussing it with a wise Brother one time. He came to the conclusion that Jesus offspring would be perfect and grow in number to eventually take over the earth and sinful men would simply go extinct. That wouldn't be the loving God we know though. He's concerned about even his sinful children and wants to give them the opportunity to live forever. It's a good thing that Jah is full of mercy and love and righteousness.
 
kirmmy said:
He came to the conclusion that Jesus offspring would be perfect
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That is in the Insight book. Jesus' genes would be dominant becasue he was perfect. He did not need a perfect wife, his children would have been perfect because perfection would be the dominant gene. And the fact that we only needed one redeemer, and not 2, a man and woman, testifies to that fact also. But the fact is the Bible makes a very specific point to talk about "seed". It is a recurring theme through out the Bible.

kirmmy said:
and grow in number to eventually take over the earth and sinful men would simply go extinct.
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That's not even the real issue. The issue is if Jesus had had children, then Adam's children/offspring could never be redeemed if his offspring would have remained faithful. Yes they would go "extinct", but only because they were sinful and that sin condemned them all to die. So to the point, Jesus did not just sacrifice his life, he sacrificed the lives of any children he could have had, and adopted Adam's children! This is in line with what Jehovah did with the first human rebels. Rather than kill them and start new, he allowed the challenge to his ruler-ship and sovereignty to play out. In order to set right his original purpose, a perfect man had to lay down his life for all mankind, and I suspect, if Jesus had chosen to take a wife and have children, that would not have been a sin, because to be "created" that way in human form and have children was God's purpose but of course that would not redeem Adam's children. In fact this would make it all the more difficult for Jesus to resist Satan, if all he had to do was decide to have a family.
 
Nomex said:
That is in the Insight book. Jesus' genes would be dominant becasue he was perfect. He did not need a perfect wife, his children would have been perfect because perfection would be the dominant gene. And the fact that we only needed one redeemer, and not 2, a man and woman, testifies to that fact also. But the fact is the Bible makes a very specific point to talk about "seed". It is a recurring theme through out the Bible.



That's not even the real issue. The issue is if Jesus had had children, then Adam's children/offspring could never be redeemed if his offspring would have remained faithful. Yes they would go "extinct", but only because they were sinful and that sin condemned them all to die. So to the point, Jesus did not just sacrifice his life, he sacrificed the lives of any children he could have had, and adopted Adam's children! This is in line with what Jehovah did with the first human rebels. Rather than kill them and start new, he allowed the challenge to his ruler-ship and sovereignty to play out. In order to set right his original purpose, a perfect man had to lay down his life for all mankind, and I suspect, if Jesus had chosen to take a wife and have children, that would not have been a sin, because to be "created" that way in human form and have children was God's purpose but of course that would not redeem Adam's children. In fact this would make it all the more difficult for Jesus to resist Satan, if all he had to do was decide to have a family.
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When Christ Jesus was baptized, he became fully aware and cognizant of his pre human, spirit existence. At that very moment, most definitely his desire to return "home" to be back alongside his heavenly Father cloaked in spiritual beauty was beyond words and any form of explanation the likes of us specs of dust could fathom or conjure up. Thus, to speculate hypothetically "If" Christ had of had children, etc is beyond recognition to me personally and borders on "________". I believe Jesus would have had zero desire for women. He was neutral. And I believe via his pre human understanding, knowledge, wisdom and unparralled love for his God it would have made the thought of cohabitating w/an earthling, frankly egregious and animalistic in equation. Thus, based on the Scriptures, why the Devil never tempted Jesus with sexual desires. Instead, he tempted him w/food, ego, pain. Even Satan knew Jesus held perfect mastery over his flesh w/perfect self control. Something pathetic Adam failed to exhibit. Where Adam's physical love for his wife was greater than for his Creator and mammy needy for her, Jesus love for his Father was immeasurable and something no fleshly woman could ever match and/or substitute. He needed only one thing...to be back with the Almighty, his beloved spirit Father, the personification of Love and the source of all masculine and feminine creation.
 
Nomex said:
That is in the Insight book. Jesus' genes would be dominant becasue he was perfect. He did not need a perfect wife, his children would have been perfect because perfection would be the dominant gene. And the fact that we only needed one redeemer, and not 2, a man and woman, testifies to that fact also. But the fact is the Bible makes a very specific point to talk about "seed". It is a recurring theme through out the Bible.



That's not even the real issue. The issue is if Jesus had had children, then Adam's children/offspring could never be redeemed if his offspring would have remained faithful. Yes they would go "extinct", but only because they were sinful and that sin condemned them all to die. So to the point, Jesus did not just sacrifice his life, he sacrificed the lives of any children he could have had, and adopted Adam's children! This is in line with what Jehovah did with the first human rebels. Rather than kill them and start new, he allowed the challenge to his ruler-ship and sovereignty to play out. In order to set right his original purpose, a perfect man had to lay down his life for all mankind, and I suspect, if Jesus had chosen to take a wife and have children, that would not have been a sin, because to be "created" that way in human form and have children was God's purpose but of course that would not redeem Adam's children. In fact this would make it all the more difficult for Jesus to resist Satan, if all he had to do was decide to have a family.
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Btw, I do highly value and immensely appreciate your love, value and desire for spiritual matters and biblical subjects and considerations. Never lose such desire
 
TheJehuChariot said:
When Christ Jesus was baptized, he became fully aware and cognizant of his pre human, spirit existence. At that very moment, most definitely his desire to return "home" to be back alongside his heavenly Father cloaked in spiritual beauty was beyond words and any form of explanation the likes of us specs of dust could fathom or conjure up. Thus, to speculate hypothetically "If" Christ had of had children, etc is beyond recognition to me personally and borders on "________". I believe Jesus would have had zero desire for women. He was neutral. And I believe via his pre human understanding, knowledge, wisdom and unparralled love for his God it would have made the thought of cohabitating w/an earthling, frankly egregious and animalistic in equation. Thus, based on the Scriptures, why the Devil never tempted Jesus with sexual desires. Instead, he tempted him w/food, ego, pain. Even Satan knew Jesus held perfect mastery over his flesh w/perfect self control. Something pathetic Adam failed to exhibit. Where Adam's physical love for his wife was greater than for his Creator and mammy needy for her, Jesus love for his Father was immeasurable and something no fleshly woman could ever match and/or substitute. He needed only one thing...to be back with the Almighty, his beloved spirit Father, the personification of Love and the source of all masculine and feminine creation.
Click to expand...
OK so look...nothing you said was wrong...my post had nothing to do with the realizations of what actually took place. My post was about the "law" in terms of what has taken place with regards to the entire challenge brought forth by Satan. Part of setting those things straight, for a fact was the fact that Jesus could have had children and perfect children. What the scriptures say is only a tiny fraction of what went on. But what the scriptures say, say a lot of what they don't say! It is an absolute fact, part of the temptation Jesus faced, was children of his own! The bible makes a point of saying "Jesus seed"...Jesus' seed is his adopted Adam offspring!
 
Nomex said:
OK so look...nothing you said was wrong...my post had nothing to do with the realizations of what actually took place. My post was about the "law" in terms of what has taken place with regards to the entire challenge brought forth by Satan. Part of setting those things straight, for a fact was the fact that Jesus could have had children and perfect children. What the scriptures say is only a tiny fraction of what went on. But what the scriptures say, say a lot of what they don't say! It is an absolute fact, part of the temptation Jesus faced, was children of his own! The bible makes a point of saying "Jesus seed"...Jesus' seed is his adopted Adam offspring!
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When Eve sinned....what IF Adam had of rebuked her and stayed obedient to God. Yes, she would then eventually die within God's day....some 900 years later. But since we're playing hypothetical here, lets say via God's allowing...Adam then cohabitated w/his then suddenly sinful , imperfect wife Eve.... and bore children with her.... do you actually think such a union would have bore "perfect" offspring? I argue a perfect man who impregnated an imperfect vessel yields an imperfect child, albeit likely more robust, healthier and more handsome than two imperfect souls. Nonetheless, death would still be imminent for the child because the female host was flawed. Under that premise....a 1st century argument over such a predicament is therefore a mute point. :) 😀 Ahhhh, it lovely being right. Lol
 
TheJehuChariot said:
do you actually think such a union would have bore "perfect" offspring?
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Yes, they would have been perfect! For an absolute fact perfect. Are you going to argue that the imperfect genes of a sinful woman would have overruled the genes of a perfect man. And why did it only require the blood of the "second Adam" to redeem Adam's offspring and not the blood of a perfect man and a perfect woman? BTW, the WT agrees with me on this one and I agree with them! You lose! :LOL:
 
TheJehuChariot said:
When Eve sinned....what IF Adam had of rebuked her and stayed obedient to God. Yes, she would then eventually die within God's day....some 900 years later.
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Okay, so wait, I missed this, this would have been the first divorce! I'm not quite sure why I need to answer this. Why not ask Jehovah what would have happened if ADAM HAD NOT SINNED?
 
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