Peace and Security?

kirmmy

Well-known member
I'll pose this question...why does the scripture says, "when ever it is they are saying peace and security, then sudden destruction will instantly be upon them." ????

This is why that wording is paramount to understanding. That sounds like Armageddon to me. The War of Armageddon is God's War against man's governments.

I'll go back and read Thessalonians and clear this all up for everyone...just give me a sec!!! LOL
That's my thought as well. The scripture indicates it is after the 8th king has conquered all and declared victory. "Sudden destruction is then upon them." Christ brings their end. But it could be the sudden destruction of the GT too but it seem so final in context.

Or it's as @Driven says; it's the sudden destruction of the Man of Lawlessness. That means they have to be the ones declaring P&S.

It really is very confusing at this juncture.

I'll probably skip ahead in my Bible reading and read Thessy 1 & 2 next.
 

The God Pill

Well-known member
Does Jehovah god need to justify himself to his creation? It appears like the son himself is enough to satisfy the father we know from scripture all creation besides his son was made by and for his firstborn it's like a man justifying himself to his kid's puppies. The issue of Jehovah's sovereignty definitely becomes an issue at Christ coronation as that's when driven mad the devil attempts his coup the war in heaven and all but prior to that it seems like with the org it's an overemphasized element of the grand drama.
 
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BARNABY THE DOG.

Well-known member
I'll pose this question...why does the scripture says, "when ever it is they are saying peace and security, then sudden destruction will instantly be upon them." ????

This is why that wording is paramount to understanding. That sounds like Armageddon to me. The War of Armageddon is God's War against man's governments.

I'll go back and read Thessalonians and clear this all up for everyone...just give me a sec!!! LOL
My thought on the scripture is that peace and security is the promise of Jehovah for His people. Thus, when the world declares that they, (though Satan) have achieved the purpose of Jehovah in spite of Him, then at that point, just as they are revelling in their achievement, Jehovah will paint a different picture for them.
 

BARNABY THE DOG.

Well-known member
In case anyone is still laboring under the delusion that the Russian invasion of Ukraine was unprovoked listen to the spokesman for the Pentagon talking about training the Ukrainian army for the past 8 years. It is shocking when professional liars blurt out the truth. But it happens every once in a while.
It’s true what you say. The propaganda in England is exceptionally one sided. Few people understand the issues, even when paralleled by the Cuban crisis of the early 60’s. I am of the opinion that this will go nuclear sooner than later. The facts as they stand are that the Russian army are loosing ground due to the weapons supplied by the west. Putin can not allow himself to be pushed out of Ukraine and he has already stated that further interference from the west will result in a swift and somewhat unpleasant (I forget his exact words) response.
 

Carl

Well-known member
I do feel in my own mind we are going to be seeing this “cry” very soon with the 2022 Convention.

This thinking makes sense, but I believe Robert's correct and it's world leaders.

The main problem I see with this is the fact that the Watchtower is only using half the phrase. What about "security"? On the other hand the exact phrase "peace and security" is embedded within the political system and is used all the time. It is noteworthy that they do not say "peace and safety" or "peace and stability" so much, but more often than not the political leaders use the phrase "peace and security." For example, just yesterday Boris Johnson accused Russia of threatening peace and security across Europe.

Those who are destroyed after declaring "P&S" could be the leaders of the 7th beast that receives the wound? They're killed/removed from power so the "10 kings" can receive their crowns.

What makes me not let go of this idea is the context of that scripture. But then I add to that my belief that the globalists are not really interested nor motivated by peace and security. They mention it now to sell their global government but the real motivation is to manipulate the people, to the benefit of the globalists.

Although Revelation does describe people who accept the mark of the beast as admiring it and even worshipping it, I have no doubt there will be a large crowd who do not go along with it. Otherwise why would they need to put people “under compulsion“?

Will Satan really get that close to achieving peace and security so as to proclaim it? Perhaps, but that really is not the context of that scripture at 1 Thessalonians 5:3. Would that day really have the possibility of overtaking the anointed “as it would thieves”? Many have proposed the “peace and security “ will be proclaimed after the chosen have died or at least while they are preaching for the 42 months. That does not fit the danger of the anointed being overtaken since they will have already been sealed. The peace and security must come before they are sealed or the scripture makes no sense. I urge each of you to read both books of Thessalonians and remember the scripture numbers are artificially inserted. Read them as their were intended to be read, as 2 letters written to one congregation with the 2nd letter being written shortly after the first.

This makes sense if the declaration comes before the GT, right before the 8th king rises. It could be the last straw, bringing on Jehovah's day? The key is at 1 Thessalonians 5:2... "For you yourselves know very well that Jehovah’s day is coming exactly as a thief in the night." Then we immediately hear... "Whenever it is that they are saying, “Peace and security!” then sudden destruction is to be instantly on them, just like birth pains on a pregnant woman, and they will by no means escape."

Just as Jesus comes as a thief, so too does Jehovah's Day... but this conflicts with the fact that we know the HOT lasts 3 & 1/2 years. So, when does Jehovah's day begin? The day after Armageddon, or the 1st day of the GT? Does the kicking off of the GT start the 1,000 Kingdom? We know this day is the beginning of Jesus' 1,000 year reign, so I believe Jehovah's day begins the day Seal 1 is opened and Jesus begins ruling in Jehovah's Name.
 

BARNABY THE DOG.

Well-known member
In case anyone is still laboring under the delusion that the Russian invasion of Ukraine was unprovoked listen to the spokesman for the Pentagon talking about training the Ukrainian army for the past 8 years. It is shocking when professional liars blurt out the truth. But it happens every once in a while.
This just in! Britain has guaranteed Sweden and Finland that if attacked, Britain will intervene. It just goes to show that if you don’t learn from history, it is bound to repeat itself. Belgium. 1914. Sigh. Last one out, turn off the new lights.
 

Watchman

Moderator
Staff member
This just in! Britain has guaranteed Sweden and Finland that if attacked, Britain will intervene. It just goes to show that if you don’t learn from history, it is bound to repeat itself. Belgium. 1914. Sigh. Last one out, turn off the new lights.
King Edward #7 used his influence to weave a tangled web of alliances in Europe that made WWI inevitable. People never learn from history. NATO is a similar tripwire. If for example, Russia were to shoot a spitball in the direction of some tiny NATO member like Lithuania, all NATO would be required to go to war against Russia. The demons have WW3 already set up and as easy to trigger as WW1 was.
 

LuisMerino9412

Well-known member
The Org has always made statements of confidence. Never stating the complete accuracy with regard to current events or their own condition. To me their bringing up the subject of peace is just another wishful theme.
There will be peace and security to a global scale and it will be brought by men... I mean people will feel confident enough to say that or at least to declare it like an agreement among nations or something like that... As I have always said it must be something huge to catch everyone's attention. First, because nations have been talking about that for many decades I would say almost a century and nothing has happened and second because because it will be the prelude to the last days.. Right after that everything will start and blow up. So, it will not be something of little importance, attention or insignificant... Perhaps that will be the first strike given by the king of the south that will lead the king of the north to act with all his force to destroy his long term enemy and his project or the final deception of Satan to drag as many as possible and catch everyone's attention before the lights start shining and the show begins...
 

StillA_WorshiperOfJah

Well-known member
We have the 2022 Convention with the theme “Pursue Peace!
Has anyone watch the first part of it? Would you reccomend? Is there any spiritual benefit?
My group overseer (who seems to be in denial about my fade) has sent me a link to watch it on JW streaming. I haven't been able to watch the broadcasts for quite some time because of the constant blatant gaslighting.
From what I remember, some off last year's was worth watching e.g. the dramatic bible reading. The symposium about nature etc?
 

BagdadBill

Well-known member
In case anyone is still laboring under the delusion that the Russian invasion of Ukraine was unprovoked listen to the spokesman for the Pentagon talking about training the Ukrainian army for the past 8 years. It is shocking when professional liars blurt out the truth. But it happens every once in a while.
I've listened to The Last American Vagabond for some time now. Ryan interacts and with Whitney Webb (and others) who is a master at unearthing things they would rather were kept secret. Ryan is a bit long winded but always on top of what is going on, especially with regard to the hypocrisy. I have to believe that many of these slips of the tongue aren't just accident. I would even accept divine influence because they don't seem to even try to hide what they are about to do to us any more.
 

kirmmy

Well-known member
Just read 1st Thess and I believe he's talking about the PTB. He begins by praising the Brother's for their endurance. In 5 he brings up the P&S thing and then goes on to tell the congo to show appreciation to the Brother's taking the lead. There isn't any mention of the apostasy in the first letter. Only in 2 Thess does he talk about the MoL. I have to conclude that it isn't the Brothers that will proclaim Peace and Security.
 
A

Amanda

Guest
I’ve been wrong before but listen to this at around 1:32 -1:54

Peace and security is mentioned a fair few times in the Bible, or peace and safety. King Hezekiah wanted "peace and security" during his lifetime. At least 4 times "peace & security is mentioned in the bible.
 
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w_stone

Guest
Judgement starts with who? The nations or with the house of God.Does the 7 head of the beast get destroyed or a sword stroke.Which they get healed from.
 

Cristo

Well-known member
So right now is the yearly pilgrimage to Mecca for Muslims and to Mt Arafat. Of interest in this years televised broadcast of the event I noticed that in the upper left hand the word "In Peace and Security" continue to flash forth. I haven't checked but perhaps it is this years theme, just as the Org has themes for the assemblies and such.

I'm not saying this has anything to do with the scripture, just found it interesting that the 2nd largest religion in the world is saying peace and security.

Screen Shot 2022-07-09 at 5.02.01 PM.png

Here is a link to the live video feed.
 

Yupyup_yup

Well-known member
Love this discussion

Safe and effective = Peace and Security

Billions of people around the world responded to it

The parallels are too close for me to discount it

I do not care if it's the exact wording what matters is the intent of the wording
 

SusanB

Well-known member
So right now is the yearly pilgrimage to Mecca for Muslims and to Mt Arafat. Of interest in this years televised broadcast of the event I noticed that in the upper left hand the word "In Peace and Security" continue to flash forth. I haven't checked but perhaps it is this years theme, just as the Org has themes for the assemblies and such.

I'm not saying this has anything to do with the scripture, just found it interesting that the 2nd largest religion in the world is saying peace and security.

View attachment 1473

Here is a link to the live video feed.
Great catch. Thanks for posting this
 
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w_stone

Guest
If you were back in the first century.And you heard Pauls letter read in the Congreation And you knew about what he said about the superfine apostles and you know about the evil slave and you heard John talk about the rocks below to waters.Then you heard the letter about Peace and Security.What would have been your first thought about who he was talking about When he said They would be saying Peace and Security.Would you think it was the Nations or so someone else?
 
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