Strange Thinking...

[Searcher]

I was very disturbed by the Update not too long ago where one of the Governing Body members asked the question, "Would Jehovah really let the Governing Body, the full time servants, special pioneers, take a medication or Covid-19 vaccine that would be harmful?"

Well, the answer to that should be clear: Yes.

Not that I am definitively saying they're all harmed, but the answer to that specific question is a Yes, absolutely. Galatians 6:7 is pretty clear on that. To think otherwise - that we can make decisions and expect God to automatically protect us from harm - is tantamount to mocking Him, I believe.

The elders talked to me about what I found so disturbing, and I told them, but they didn't understand. So I asked them directly if they thought Jehovah allows us to make decisions, especially medical decisions, that could harm us.

The elder said, "No. He won't let us."

I nearly collapsed because I couldn't believe my ears. I cited Galatians 6:7, and explained that God is not going to stop harmful outcomes from choices that we make using our own free will.

He said, "That's just your interpretation of that scripture."

I felt like I was speaking to robots who had no understanding. I'm not judging them, but I can't say I wasn't unbelievably frustrated with them!!!

Anyways, not sure what this post is about. Just felt like sharing my own experience I guess. It's a very weird feeling to feel so isolated, not just physically now, but mentally. Mentally isolated from virtually everyone I've ever known and grown up with in my home town. It's very strange. Well, glad I can come here and talk to some friends, though we all may be far away.

 

[Ana]

Me inquietó mucho la Actualización no hace mucho tiempo en la que uno de los miembros del Cuerpo Gobernante hizo la pregunta: "¿De verdad permitiría Jehová que el Cuerpo Gobernante, los siervos de tiempo completo, los precursores especiales, tomaran un medicamento o una vacuna contra el covid-19 que sería ¿dañino?"

Bueno, la respuesta a eso debería ser clara: sí.

No es que esté diciendo definitivamente que todos están dañados, pero la respuesta a esa pregunta específica es Sí, absolutamente. Gálatas 6:7 es bastante claro al respecto. Pensar lo contrario, que podemos tomar decisiones y esperar que Dios nos proteja automáticamente del daño, es equivalente a burlarse de Él, creo.

Los ancianos me hablaron de lo que me pareció tan perturbador y les dije, pero no entendieron. Así que les pregunté directamente si creían que Jehová nos permite tomar decisiones, especialmente decisiones médicas, que podrían hacernos daño.

El anciano dijo: "No. No nos dejará".

Casi colapsé porque no podía creer lo que escuchaba. Cité Gálatas 6:7 y expliqué que Dios no va a detener los resultados dañinos de las decisiones que tomamos usando nuestro libre albedrío.

Él dijo: "Esa es simplemente su interpretación de esa escritura".

Sentí que estaba hablando con robots que no entendieron. ¡No los estoy juzgando, pero no puedo decir que no estaba increíblemente frustrado con ellos!

De todos modos, no estoy seguro de qué trata esta publicación. Solo tenía ganas de compartir mi propia experiencia, supongo. Es una sensación muy extraña sentirse tan aislado, no solo vestirse ahora, sino mentalmente. Mentalmente aislado de casi todos los que he conocido y crecido en mi ciudad natal. Es muy extraño. Bueno, me alegro de poder venir aquí y hablar con algunos amigos, aunque todos estemos lejos.

Si, la verdad es que al principio es duro. Personalmente me desvincule siendo muy joven hace más de 20 años en años en los que necesité mucho el calor de una hermandad espiritual. Sumado a que toda mi familia me rechazo. Además no existía un lugar como este, donde comentar nuestras emociones dentro de la WT. Pero creo que ese alejamiento a la vez termino en un acercamiento a Jehová de una manera inigualable. Imagina lo que será incluso descubrir esa soledad en la gran tribulación...La experiencia les hará denunciarse unos a otros, un padre a un hijo. Que desastre!, no quiero estar en esa posicion. Ahora tenemos tiempo de fortalecernos de una manera menos forzada, un tiempo más favorable, como dice la escritura. Asi que animo!!! Te mando un fuerte abrazo!!!

 

[TruthLover]

It truly is. When I spoke to one brother telling him that I wouldn't get these vaccines as I believe them to be harmful, he quoted this from brother Splane. I said that's not true, that Jehovah wouldn't stop harm from coming to his people if they hadn't done what was right. I also said we should not be putting Jehovah to the test by taking something if we believe it to be harmful. It scares me just what other direction ones will follow without scriptural basis.
The whole problem is the belief that the GBs direction has to be coming from Jehovah and that he wouldn't allow it otherwise.

 

[Dorothea]

I was very disturbed by the Update not too long ago where one of the Governing Body members asked the question, "Would Jehovah really let the Governing Body, the full time servants, special pioneers, take a medication or Covid-19 vaccine that would be harmful?"

Well, the answer to that should be clear: Yes.

Not that I am definitively saying they're all harmed, but the answer to that specific question is a Yes, absolutely. Galatians 6:7 is pretty clear on that. To think otherwise - that we can make decisions and expect God to automatically protect us from harm - is tantamount to mocking Him, I believe.

The elders talked to me about what I found so disturbing, and I told them, but they didn't understand. So I asked them directly if they thought Jehovah allows us to make decisions, especially medical decisions, that could harm us.

The elder said, "No. He won't let us."

I nearly collapsed because I couldn't believe my ears. I cited Galatians 6:7, and explained that God is not going to stop harmful outcomes from choices that we make using our own free will.

He said, "That's just your interpretation of that scripture."

I felt like I was speaking to robots who had no understanding. I'm not judging them, but I can't say I wasn't unbelievably frustrated with them!!!

Anyways, not sure what this post is about. Just felt like sharing my own experience I guess. It's a very weird feeling to feel so isolated, not just physically now, but mentally. Mentally isolated from virtually everyone I've ever known and grown up with in my home town. It's very strange. Well, glad I can come here and talk to some friends, though we all may be far away.

I truly understand. I've been feeling the same, mentally isolated from nearly everyone. That comment from Splane floored me too. I was like....yyyyyess? Of course he would. Where did they ever get the idea that Jehovah shields us from the consequences of our choices?

 

[יהוה_saves]

Not that I am definitively saying they're all harmed,

i’ll say it. They are all harmed- every single person that accepted a dose of the viral vector DNA-altering lethal mRNA injection. These shots are NOT vaccines. There. i said it.

 

[Searcher]

Si, la verdad es que al principio es duro. Personalmente me desvincule siendo muy joven hace más de 20 años en años en los que necesité mucho el calor de una hermandad espiritual. Sumado a que toda mi familia me rechazo. Además no existía un lugar como este, donde comentar nuestras emociones dentro de la WT. Pero creo que ese alejamiento a la vez termino en un acercamiento a Jehová de una manera inigualable. Imagina lo que será incluso descubrir esa soledad en la gran tribulación...La experiencia les hará denunciarse unos a otros, un padre a un hijo. Que desastre!, no quiero estar en esa posicion. Ahora tenemos tiempo de fortalecernos de una manera menos forzada, un tiempo más favorable, como dice la escritura. Asi que animo!!! Te mando un fuerte abrazo!!!

This is so true. It's a very scary thing to imagine what will happen between all the people thinking like this!!! And they are turning on each other already. They told me that if I speak about what I think of the line of reasoning in the update like that, then I will have no friends because no one wants to hear that. It was just sad. I told them, "Well I'm not going to censor myself and the scriptures I know to be true... So I guess if no one wants to be my friend... I can't really help that."

I am sending you a hug of encouragement right back. We have to stay strong. All our reliance will have to be on Yahweh... it scares me to think of the future, but I also feel determined. It's a rollercoaster for sure.

 

[Searcher]

It truly is. When I spoke to one brother telling him that I wouldn't get these vaccines as I believe them to be harmful, he quoted this from brother Splane. I said that's not true, that Jehovah wouldn't stop harm from coming to his people if they hadn't done what was right. I also said we should not be putting Jehovah to the test by taking something if we believe it to be harmful. It scares me just what other direction ones will follow without scriptural basis.
The whole problem is the belief that the GBs direction has to be coming from Jehovah and that he wouldn't allow it otherwise.

Yes, I think that's the root of the problem. So even though people think, Yes the GB can make mistakes... They end up concluding, But God is directing them so it will all be fine, no matter what we do.

Did the brother see your point when you said that? I was actually a little bit freaked out when both elders didn't see a problem with that question and also didn't seem to understand that scripture. I fear what other unscriptural things might be directed in the future too, for sure.

 

[יהוה_saves]

I truly understand. I've been feeling the same, mentally isolated from nearly everyone. That comment from Splane floored me too. I was like....yyyyyess? Of course he would. Where did they ever get the idea that Jehovah shields us from the consequences of our choices?

Exactly. the Gov Body has linked Jehovah’s name to these harmful injections in a very psychologically manipulative way. These men are truly and hopelessly lost- all of them. Their instructions should be publicly repudiated and renounced by all JWs as it is not merely strange, illogical, and impractical, but also unscriptural and DANGEROUS.

 

[Searcher]

I truly understand. I've been feeling the same, mentally isolated from nearly everyone. That comment from Splane floored me too. I was like....yyyyyess? Of course he would. Where did they ever get the idea that Jehovah shields us from the consequences of our choices?

I don't know?!?! I have never, in my whole life, heard anything like that. Ever. It really rocked me to my core, honestly!

What I find so incredibly interesting is how it has affected people differently though. Like for you and I, and many others here, it shocked us and made us think more. But for others... It appears to be a total trap. It's comforted them and made them turn off their reasoning even further. 😬

 

[Searcher]

i’ll say it. They are all harmed- every single person that accepted a dose of the viral vector DNA-altering lethal mRNA injection. These shots are NOT vaccines. There. i said it.

Totally agree, personally, and I say it sadly too because so many people are completely unaware and don't question it because it's been the direction from the top down... I shudder to think about it all.

 

[Searcher]

Exactly. the Gov Body has linked Jehovah’s name to these harmful injections in a very psychologically manipulative way. These men are truly and hopelessly lost- all of them. Their instructions should be publicly repudiated and renounced by all JWs as it is not merely strange, illogical, and impractical, it’s unscriptural and DANGEROUS.

I do agree. This is absolutely dangerous behaviour. The elders read to me a sheet of paper saying that the Society does not endorse ANY medical treatment.

But I said that unfortunately that just appears to be doublespeak. It's just impossible to say that they're neutral now and that they're not reccomending a "health" product. But the brothers I spoke to insisted that they weren't reccomending it. I showed them examples that they were indeed - direct quotes! And they said, "They're just stating facts." I said, "Why not state other facts then! Like perhaps possible debilitating side effects/deaths?" But they said, again, "It's just your interpretation that they're telling people to do it."

Needless to say, it became a bit of a circular argument. When I quoted Galatians 6:7, actually, the one brother said, "You're just trying to sound wise, quoting scriptures. You like the sound of your own voice and your interpretations of all of this nonsense."

It's shocking behaviour to me. I told him I wasn't trying to be "wise," I was just saying what I had studied and what I know to be true from God's Word....

Well anyways, it was pointless and upsetting, really. It's like being gaslit. There's NO way they can say it's not being endorsed. There's no way!

 

[Dorothea]

I don't know?!?! I have never, in my whole life, heard anything like that. Ever. It really rocked me to my core, honestly!

What I find so incredibly interesting is how it has affected people differently though. Like for you and I, and many others here, it shocked us and made us think more. But for others... It appears to be a total trap. It's comforted them and made them turn off their reasoning even further. 😬

Yeah, the vast majority are in the latter camp. It's so discouraging to see it. Like the Israelites worshiping the golden calf right after they saw Jehovah part the Red Sea.

 

[יהוה_saves]

Totally agree, personally, and I say it sadly too because so many people are completely unaware and don't question it because it's been the direction from the top down... I shudder to think about it all.

i shudder too. I also believe that more JWs suffering from the effects of lethal injection make the connection that it’s the injection, than don’t. But they can’t openly admit it to themselves because if they do their entire faith in Watchtower falls apart (Splane: would Jehovah allow his people to take something that is harmful?) Massive cognitive dissonance.

 

[Searcher]

Yeah, the vast majority are in the latter camp. It's so discouraging to see it. Like the Israelites worshiping the golden calf right after they saw Jehovah part the Red Sea.

Yessss... This is what we have compared it to as well. It's robot mentality. Actually, there's such a good old article on robotic thinking and behaviour like this; when everyone stops using their own reasoning .. https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1955120

I wish they'd study this right now lol 😅😪

 

[יהוה_saves]

There's NO way they can say it's not being endorsed. There's no way!

Agreed. nope. no way. that ship sailed. It’s all on the Gov Body now- the blood guilt that is.

 

[Searcher]

i shudder too. I also believe that more JWs suffering from the effects of lethal injection make the connection that it’s the injection, than don’t. But they can’t openly admit it to themselves because if they do their entire faith in Watchtower falls apart (Splane: would Jehovah allow his people to take something that is harmful?) Massive cognitive dissonance.

Ok that's a good point. Because I know people that have been having some bizarre (clearly side effects) health problems (starting right after their 🐍bite) ... But they never link the two together. And in my head, I just can't fathom it. How do they not put two and two together??

But what you've just said make sense to me. And now I'm even more sad for them. They can't even admit what may be happening because it shatters their entire world 😪

 

[Dorothea]

Yessss... This is what we have compared it to as well. It's robot mentality. Actually, there's such a good old article on robotic thinking and behaviour like this; when everyone stops using their own reasoning .. https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1955120

I

"The basic fact is that this country has been going through a wave of hysteria. When people are afraid they do strange things. One of their immediate responses is a tendency to abandon their liberties.” - Science News Letter for November 6, 1954

"Why is the world so sick that even the “free world” enslaves itself in a tyranny of hysteria, fear and robot minds? Because the whole earth is being misled by a superhuman sick mind, Satan the Devil. This is a fact that is kept from the people. But the Bible is clear: “Satan, who is misleading the entire inhabited earth.” So not only Communist countries but the entire earth is under the fiendish influence of this master wicked spirit. Those who value their life must wake up their mental faculties. This is the time for clear thinking, not apathy. Wrote the apostle Peter: “I am arousing your clear thinking faculties.” And what does clear thinking reveal? This: a new world is at hand.—Rev. 12:9; 2 Pet. 3:1, NW." (from the above cited article)

 

[OnlyJah]

I was very disturbed by the Update not too long ago where one of the Governing Body members asked the question, "Would Jehovah really let the Governing Body, the full time servants, special pioneers, take a medication or Covid-19 vaccine that would be harmful?"

Well, the answer to that should be clear: Yes.

Not that I am definitively saying they're all harmed, but the answer to that specific question is a Yes, absolutely. Galatians 6:7 is pretty clear on that. To think otherwise - that we can make decisions and expect God to automatically protect us from harm - is tantamount to mocking Him, I believe.

The elders talked to me about what I found so disturbing, and I told them, but they didn't understand. So I asked them directly if they thought Jehovah allows us to make decisions, especially medical decisions, that could harm us.

The elder said, "No. He won't let us."

I nearly collapsed because I couldn't believe my ears. I cited Galatians 6:7, and explained that God is not going to stop harmful outcomes from choices that we make using our own free will.

He said, "That's just your interpretation of that scripture."

I felt like I was speaking to robots who had no understanding. I'm not judging them, but I can't say I wasn't unbelievably frustrated with them!!!

Anyways, not sure what this post is about. Just felt like sharing my own experience I guess. It's a very weird feeling to feel so isolated, not just physically now, but mentally. Mentally isolated from virtually everyone I've ever known and grown up with in my home town. It's very strange. Well, glad I can come here and talk to some friends, though we all may be far away.

(Ecclesiastes 5:6) . . .. Why should the [true] God become indignant on account of your voice and have to wreck the work of your hands?

 

[OnlyJah]

(Ecclesiastes 5:6) . . .. Why should the [true] God become indignant on account of your voice and have to wreck the work of your hands?

If we make mistakes or deliberate sins that is down to us. Jah did not stop Eve doing something harmful or other people in the Bible,

 

[SollaSollew]

I was very disturbed by the Update not too long ago where one of the Governing Body members asked the question, "Would Jehovah really let the Governing Body, the full time servants, special pioneers, take a medication or Covid-19 vaccine that would be harmful?"

Well, the answer to that should be clear: Yes.

The answer is "no", the real question is:

Would the Governing Body really let the full time servants, special pioneers, take a medication or Covid-19 vaccine that would be harmful?" - Answer: YES!