Jesus Name - Proof of the GB's Deceptive Teaching of the Faithful Slave

DoubleThink333 said:

Is that like a dig on my username...? I am genuinely asking for further explanation of how what was posted is proof of the GB denying Christ and replacing him. Seriously and sincerely. I’m not disagreeing with the claim but I don’t see the proof of it in what was posted. Can you PLEASE explain further???

And don’t mistake my not reading between the lines of the text you posted to mean I’m some kind of “double thinker” which is the ability, defined by Orwell in his novel 1984, to hold two contradictory beliefs and believe both of them to be true at the same time. My username is DoubleThink because most people actually engage in double think and have no idea that they are doing so and attention needs to be drawn to it.

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Yup it is. But to make something plain to you since you seem sincere, l'll spell it out for you. When the GB tells anointed "domestics" that their relationship with God depends upon them and their spiritual food as the Faithful slave/ managers of God's household, they are saying that anointing and the mediation of that relationship belongs to them. They become a mediator of the new covenant instead of Christ. They put themselves in Christs place. I know because I was disfellowshipped for pointing that out. I cannot be reinstated unless I recognize the governing body as the faithful slave. So when Robert calls me delusional he is badly mistaken and just being a bully.

A B said:

That was Carl not Kevin that had the family member.....

Kevin, I got about 40-some pages into your 100+ page pdf and I saw some things that I thought correct, some interesting things to think about, but mostly what I saw was your jumping off point was incorrect. You went nuclear with Watchtower's adjustment as to who the FDS was, but you were both wrong. The identity of the FDS is tightly bound with the appointment over all the belongings. When this was moved from 1914 into the future all should have recognized there is no FDS yet. There may be leading contenders but the determination of who the FDS is not made until the appointment over 'many things'. Compare Mt 25:14-30. What I saw was, you want to claim ownership of that term incorrectly the same way the Watchtower does.

Its the same with the great/large crowd that doesn't officially exist yet.

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Thanks AB, I appreciate critical thinking when it given respectfully. As I said in the book I'm not inspired and I may have some things wrong, but it was my best effort to date. Take from it what you can digest, new things are coming. I'm updating the locust plague of Revelation to include the other sheep in regard to those who do not have the seal.

My bone of contention of the faithful slave teaching is quite personal as I was disfellowshipped for refusing to identify the GB as the FS. When the GB identified themselves as the FS they were lying outwrite. Your right, those who represent that group won't be clearly identified until the end. I do know that. But what the GB did was put themselves in the place of Christ as mediator of the new covenant, in other words a person cant be anointed or saved without recognizing the GB as the faithful slave.

Manoah said:

HAVE THEY SIDELINED JESUS
The last 2 WT study articles:
ORGANIZATION = 27 & 32
JESUS = 1 & 2

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It's just lip service. In reality if Jesus himself was on earth and talked to them personally about his place over the cong, and they didn't know it was him, they would disfellowship him. I know because I stood up for his authority over the congregation as the only name given by God by which we can be saved and they tossed me. They do not posses God's authority to anoint or Jesus authority to mediate the new covenant. But the certainly assumed it as you can see by their teaching. To say the relationship of anointed brothers and sisters with God depends on the GB and their spiritual food is an outrage and contemptable to Jehovah and Christ. it a rejection of both Jehovah and Christ authority and similar to the power grab of bishops of the 4th century.

Jehovahsloyalchild said:

The GB has not denied Jesus Christ is the Son of God nor have they become full on Antichrists (YET) Antichrist is someone who apostatized and returned to false trinity doctrinal teachings after learning the truth about Jesus and Jehovahs Father son relationship. Antichrist is only really explained in the book of 1 John. John was referring to is those who deny Jesus is God's son not God himself. Deny he was born in the flesh as 100% man. Antichrist by not accepting Jesus as separate from God not accepting him as Jehovahs firstborn creation insisting that Jesus is God that when he came to earth he was half man half God. AntiChrist is denying the divinity of Jehovah and Jesus. The WT is certainly is in position to become AntiChrists when Jesus does return. They are setting witnesses up to trust only them listen to them no matter how strange or impractical. Once Jesus does return they will attempt to further mislead his sheep and put themselves in complete opposition to Jesus asserting themselves fully in his place. That is what will make them AntiChrists.

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Sorry we'll have to agree to disagree. Read their own definition, where does the article on antichrist say it only applies to apostates who accepted the trinity? The definition is much broader in scope than that. Any denial of Christ is antichrist. Whether it is to say he's not the messiah, or he never came to earth or to replace his authority with their own.

DR74minus said:

Arrogant son a ? aren't you? Like I said we might need to make sure our vision is clear before we try to help with the vision of others.

If you weren't so up yourself you would probably know that our host wrote a book and sent it to members of the G/B
and to congregations across part of the planet. I have also given warnings to elders in a couple 3 congregation about the G/B's Hypocrisy, and more recently, about the fake Covid 19 and the dangers of the vax. I suspect others on the forum have done similar. I have not warned them about denying the Christ. Thats your bullshit so I'll let you sound that alarm.

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Maybe you've replaced the watchtower idol with an RK idol. I know his circumstances, he attacked me, not the other way around. All I did was post this topic thinking is was not out of harmony with his article "The end of Jehovah's organization". Did I call him delusional? No! I'm actually quite shocked at how I was attacked by people who feel that Jehovah's organization has lost its way and replaced God with the Watchtower idol but have somehow not denied Christ. There's nothing wrong with this topic and speaking truth is not arrogance. I was disfellowshipped for refusing to recognize the governing body as the faithful slave because I knew it elevated them to Christ's place as mediator. RK stepped up, I stepped up, how about you? I leave judgement to Jehovah, and judgement is coming on JW's, if you're still one, stay in at your own peri and keep pretending.

DR74minus said:

Arrogant son a ? aren't you? Like I said we might need to make sure our vision is clear before we try to help with the vision of others.

If you weren't so up yourself you would probably know that our host wrote a book and sent it to members of the G/B
and to congregations across part of the planet. I have also given warnings to elders in a couple 3 congregation about the G/B's Hypocrisy, and more recently, about the fake Covid 19 and the dangers of the vax. I suspect others on the forum have done similar. I have not warned them about denying the Christ. Thats your bullshit so I'll let you sound that alarm.

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KevinB said:

Thanks AB, I appreciate critical thinking when it given respectfully. As I said in the book I'm not inspired and I may have some things wrong, but it was my best effort to date. Take from it what you can digest, new things are coming. I'm updating the locust plague of Revelation to include the other sheep in regard to those who do not have the seal.

My bone of contention of the faithful slave teaching is quite personal as I was disfellowshipped for refusing to identify the GB as the FS. When the GB identified themselves as the FS they were lying outwrite. Your right, those who represent that group won't be clearly identified until the end. I do know that. But what the GB did was put themselves in the place of Christ as mediator of the new covenant, in other words a person cant be anointed or saved without recognizing the GB as the faithful slave.

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Sometimes the labels we place on things create more weight than need be or add unnecessary confusion. There might be a bit of that going on here. After Jesus died, let's say in the year 50 or 60 for example, any new Christian with a heavenly hope would have to have some recognition of the apostles. They were the ones that traveled with Jesus, recorded the events and his words. If you were a new Christian at that time, unless you had a unique privilege of spending time with any of the original 11, likely much of your knowledge came from 3rd or 4th hand word of mouth and/or the writings circulating at the time. When circumcision became an issue and Jesus wasn't there to answer it, it fell back to the group with the best credentials to answer the question. Everyone seemed to recognize that as appropriate. There might have been a few dissenters still but they didn't make it into the Bible and memory of them has faded.

When Brother Knorr proposed Gilead some of the brothers gave him a hard time, 'have you no faith' they were reported to have said meaning if you really believe Armageddon is coming why are you getting involved in all this. Some people when they grasped the size and length of the work Gilead would begin (beyond many observer's lifetimes) concluded this is God's work, not mans. I find the lower case gb for the first century governing body and the switch to capital GB for the modern day very peculiar. Still, there are tens of thousands of congregations around the world that can trace their existence back to what Brother Knorr started. That the current GB has inherited that organization does give them some claim. Jesus is still the name that saves but they have inherited the vast delivery system regardless of if the Kingdom is officially ruling yet or not.

I was at the annual meeting for the talk that later became the article 'The Faithful Slave and its Governing Body'. This was the precursor to the talk and article confining the FDS to the responsible brothers at headquarters. (and that talk was not a change, it just used new words to describe what was already in place) I was told at the time the reason for the talk was that there were many younger anointed from democratic countries that felt they should have some say in what the organization was doing. Setting aside the issue of when the slave is found faithful and discreet, I do agree there is a negative aspect of too many cooks in the kitchen. It does not matter if we drive on the left or right side of the road, it matters that everyone drives on the same side.

Everybody thinks that the Bible does not tell us when the end comes. It tells us exactly when the end comes. When the number is filled. I do not think it had nefarious intent, but considering what was taught and believed at the time, I can thoroughly understand why the brothers thought the heavenly call closed in 1935. But if it was not true, even if reasonable for the circumstances, it was almost an anti-Christ like teaching. It might remind some people of 'you shut up the kingdom of God and prevent others from going in'. Regardless, that teaching never stopped Jehovah from anointing who he wanted and it eventually fell by the wayside. I never believed resurrected ones wouldn't marry and that teaching fell albeit a bit dysfunctionally.

I disagree with your last sentence above, history proves they are unable to mediate the new covenant, they tried to shut it up, declare it closed, even if it was done innocently and with good intent, it was unable to stand because they are not mediating it. You just agreed that the group isn't positively identified until the end so how does that really translate that someone can't be anointed without recognizing them as the faithful slave. This is where those labels get tricky. It might be more accurate to say it is not possible for someone to be anointed without much of the information they have made possible, just as in the middle first century it could not happen without the knowledge the apostles made available. Even Cornelius had to be baptized in Jesus name after receiving the Holy Spirit.

I thought it very insightful on your part to to think they should not be part of a legal corporation when they had already separated. It is very unusual for someone to be thinking about those things.

My opinion is that the FDS/ES illustration is simply that, an illustration, for each individual Christian to be faithful, and to be found such on Jesus' return. It seems that was how Jesus made other similar illustrations. For individual application. It is not a prophecy. Not a "class". Not a "group", and not an "organization." I am not alone in this understanding. Many have written quality explanations in harmony with Scripture on this topic. I feel the Watchtower explanation has led to a fall premise, upon which much confusion has been built. There is no group or organization (in some man-made sectarian sense) that will ever receive a "well done" and be given more responsibility by Christ at his coming. Just faithful individual Christians. (Which could only be looked at, after the fact, as a group of faithful individual Christians. Hence, individual wheat and tares must be separated at Christ's return.)

KevinB said:

I stepped up, how about you?

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You've stepped up? I'm pleased for you. For 35 years I was seen by at least 2 elders possibly more in more than one congregation as one who has trouble following directions. I've been inactive in my "official" congregation since 2002 I am still inactive in the congregation. I been attending another congregation .occasionally via zoom since 2019.but have never met anyone of the brothers and sisters. I have spoken to a couple elders. At a shepherding call via phone conference I was asked point blank by one elder if I accepted that the G/B were the faithful and discrete slave? I said no. The only comeback from him was "at least you're honest" I have not stopped rubbishing the G/B via emails. To one of those elders at the call and 2 other elders from 2 other congregations. As yet they have not messaged me to meet. I'll see what happens moving forward.

Wonder if honest can be said about you. You're right nothing is wrong with the topic, Just your comments although sincere are suspect. You have your story all mixed up. but that does not make you arrogant. You setting yourself up as a modern day Ezekiel by saying "you have been warned" like you was some kind of judge. That is the arrogance. Maybe you think our host and others on this forum are taking a false step and you're here to correct our steps.
Give me a break. Yet more arrogance "if you're still one, stay in at your own peri and keep pretending" Goodnight! I'm in danger if I call myself a JW, Oh dear how sad never mind. At least I'll be judged fair by Jehovah. RK might have you pegged correctly as delusional. Confused, and a liar prehaps.

Take it easy,

Peace out.

Joe MacTeeg said:

My opinion is that the FDS/ES illustration is simply that, an illustration, for each individual Christian to be faithful, and to be found such on Jesus' return. It seems that was how Jesus made other similar illustrations. For individual application. It is not a prophecy. Not a "class". Not a "group", and not an "organization." I am not alone in this understanding. Many have written quality explanations in harmony with Scripture on this topic. I feel the Watchtower explanation has led to a fall premise, upon which much confusion has been built. There is no group or organization (in some man-made sectarian sense) that will ever receive a "well done" and be given more responsibility by Christ at his coming. Just faithful individual Christians. (Which could only be looked at, after the fact, as a group of faithful individual Christians. Hence, individual wheat and tares must be separated at Christ's return.)

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First of all nice to know you're still around Joe. You make some good points. Jesus said the Master left someone in charge of his household to feed the flock in his absence. But before he left He asked a rhetorical question "Who really is the faithful and discrete slave" and part of the illustration was "happy is that slave if the master upon arriving finds him doing so he will be appointed over all his belongings" in this particular illustration and case; feeding the flock.

Are you saying that no-one was given the task to feed the flock while Jesus was away. If you are, then tell us your take based on the quality explanation that you have come across, that is in harmony with scripture, what that illustration means? If it does not mean what is says? Keep in mind your explanation must be in harmony with scripture. I'm interested to see how you explain in what sense is each individual appointed over all "his Belongings" ? "who really is the faithful and discrete slave whom his master appointed over his domestics to give them their food at the proper time? Happy is that slave if the master on coming finds him doing so truly I say to you he will appoint him over all his belongings." Mt 24:45-47. If the scripture dose not mean what is says then what does it mean? In what sense are these verses speaking about an individual. I will say that there is more to these verses than what they say, and an organization is not mentioned here, and neither is a particular group mentioned. But we must still look at the context to get the meaning of what the verses mean.

KevinB said:

In what world do you live in where you publicly and repeatedly say JW’s have replaced God with the WT idol, but then with the other side of your mouth tell me they have not denied Christ? WOW! Just wow!

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You don't get it. The point is Jehovah has an organization. Jesus appointed a slave to feed his household. Some of those slaves become evil and deny the master. They become apostates. You cannot become apostate unless you at one time were faithful. Jehovah's organization has become apostate. Christ will judge the organization, not because it is not Jehovah's organization, but because it is.

Truth_Seeker said:

When He had taken the scroll, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb, each one holding a harp and golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints. And they *sang a new song, saying, “Worthy are You to take the scroll and to break its seals; for You were slaughtered, and You purchased people for God with Your blood from every tribe, language, people, and nation. You have made them into a kingdom and priests to our God, and they will reign upon the earth.” Then I looked, and I heard the voices of many angels around the throne and the living creatures and the elders; and the number of them was myriads of myriads, and thousands of thousands, saying with a loud voice, “Worthy is the Lamb that was slaughtered to receive power, wealth, wisdom, might, honor, glory, and blessing.” And I heard every created thing which is in heaven, or on the earth, or under the earth, or on the sea, and all the things in them, saying, “To Him who sits on the throne and to the Lamb be the blessing, the honor, the glory, and the dominion forever and ever.” And the four living creatures were saying, “Amen.” And the elders fell down and worshiped.
Revelation 5:8‭-‬14

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Here the revelation shows Jesus standing by the side of God's throne. The elders (who appear to be the saints or the church of Jehovah under Christ) fell down before the lamb, and also when the elders presented their worship to God, Jesus did not join them, He was by the side that received that worship.

“Behold, My Servant whom I have chosen; My Beloved in whom My soul delights; I will put My Spirit upon Him, And He will proclaim justice to the Gentiles. “He will not quarrel, nor cry out; Nor will anyone hear His voice in the streets. “A bent reed He will not break off, And a dimly burning wick He will not extinguish, Until He leads justice to victory. “And in His name the Gentiles will hope.”
Matthew 12:18‭-‬21

DR74minus said:

First of all nice to know you're still around Joe. You make some good points. Jesus said the Master left someone in charge of his household to feed the flock in his absence. But before he left He asked a rhetorical question "Who really is the faithful and discrete slave" and part of the illustration was "happy is that slave if the master upon arriving finds him doing so he will be appointed over all his belongings" in this particular illustration and case; feeding the flock.

Are you saying that no-one was given the task to feed the flock while Jesus was away. If you are, then tell us your take based on the quality explanation that you have come across, that is in harmony with scripture, what that illustration means? If it does not mean what is says? Keep in mind your explanation must be in harmony with scripture. I'm interested to see how you explain in what sense is each individual appointed over all "his Belongings" ? "who really is the faithful and discrete slave whom his master appointed over his domestics to give them their food at the proper time? Happy is that slave if the master on coming finds him doing so truly I say to you he will appoint him over all his belongings." Mt 24:45-47. If the scripture dose not mean what is says then what does it mean? In what sense are these verses speaking about an individual. I will say that there is more to these verses than what they say, and an organization is not mentioned here, and neither is a particular group mentioned. But we must still look at the context to get the meaning of what the verses mean.

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Your post contains some premises about what it says, which requires reading into the text things which are not there.

The context is Jesus admonition about being faithful and watchful individual Christians. Ray Franz has written well on this, as has R. J. Furuli. (My Beloved Religion) You really need to do your own research on this, if you are sincere. Read Franz, Furuli, the majority of bible commentators, only the Watchtower seems to have turned this into a prophecy instead of a simple illustration. (It does not say: "spiritual food" (hint as to false premise) ) Here is a brief portion from Franz's "In Search of Christian Freedom".

Matthew’s account, the one most frequently referred to by the
Watch Tower Society, is paralleled by that found in Luke chapter
twelve. Luke gives a more specific designation to the “slave.” A
“slave” (Greek ) can be any kind of servant. Luke’s account identifies
the slave as a “steward” (Greek oikonomos). This factor helps
throw light on the sense and application of Jesus’ parable because
of other Scriptural teaching regarding stewardship for Christians.
In reality, according to the context, Jesus’ opening question, “Who
really is the faithful and discreet slave,” is presented, not primarily as
focusing on the identifying of some person or group, but as introducing
a moral lesson that focuses on the conduct and course that demonstrate
one to be a faithful and prudent steward of the Master. The
Jerusalem Bible thus renders his words at Luke 12:42:

What sort of steward, then, is faithful and wise enough for the
master to place him over his household to give them their allowance
of food at the proper time?

48 Romans 2:6, 7; 14:11, 12; Revelation 2:23,

The Faithful and Discreet Slave 169

Thus, Jesus was essentially saying, ‘Who among you disciples
will prove himself to be such a faithful and discreet steward?’49
The answer would depend on what each one did, not on what he
belonged to or was part of.

Additionally, Luke’s account immediately follows this parable
with Jesus’ words about the slave who understands but does not
do, and so receives many strokes, and the one who does not understand
and therefore does not do and thus receives few strokes.

Jesus, at Luke 12:48, concludes with this application of the lesson:
Indeed, everyone to whom much was given, much will be
demanded of him; and the one whom people put in charge of much,
they will demand more than usual of him.

Rather than speaking of a group or “class,” the primary application
by Christ himself is to the individual Christian, what he does
as an individual and what he proves himself to be.

Nor is this the only indication. Jesus’ inspired apostles likewise discussed
faithful stewardship in their writings. We should expect that in doing so
they would reflect Jesus’ own teaching on the subject. Notably, their discussion
is consistently on a personal level with personal application. In his
first letter to the congregation in Corinth (4:1, 2), the apostle Paul writes of
the service he and his companions rendered, and says:

Let a man so appraise us as being subordinates of Christ and
stewards of sacred secrets of God. Besides, in this case, what is
looked for in stewards is for a man to be found faithful.

The identical principle found in Jesus’ parable as recorded by
Luke, that of proving oneself to be a faithful steward of the Lord,
is here stated. Paul went on to show that this was not something
that humans could determine or render judgment on; they could
not make the definitive, determinative, valid identification of who
was or was not such a “faithful steward.” Paul then shows who
could and would, and when and on what basis, saying:

Now to me it is a very trivial matter that I should be examined by you
or by a human tribunal. Even I do not examine myself. For I am not
conscious of anything against myself. Yet by this I am not proved
righteous, but he that examines me is Jehovah. Hence do not judge
anything before the due time, until the Lord comes who will both bring the
secret things of darkness to light and make the counsels of the hearts
manifest, and then each one will have his praise come to him from God.
50
49 Compare the quite similar use of “who” in Psalm 15:1-5.
50 1 Corinthians 4:3-5,

Watchman said:

You don't get it. The point is Jehovah has an organization. Jesus appointed a slave to feed his household. Some of those slaves become evil and deny the master. They become apostates. You cannot become apostate unless you at one time were faithful. Jehovah's organization has become apostate. Christ will judge the organization, not because it is not Jehovah's organization, but because it is.

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Well, that brings up the crux of the matter. Rutherford was the one who coined the idea of "Jehovah's organization". And he did so claiming that Jesus "came to the temple" and "inspected" in 1919. (Malachi 3:1-3) Rutherford also claimed that since Jesus had "come with his angels", the "communication" was now coming directly from "the angels" to him. (He also said the "helper" holy spirit was no more, and not needed.)

He did away with the Watchtower magazine editorial board, claiming that "Jehovah" now communicated "directly". If one reads the alleged "spiritual food" at the time, one finds the worst books on the Bible ever written. Rutherford had "classes" for everything. (Mordecai class, Esther class, Ruth class, Naomi class, etc.) His books were complete rubbish. Embarrassing.

So, looking at the complete Watchtower history, (I personally read every Russell and Rutherford book, over 14,000 pages. Many key WT mag articles, and the first 3 books post Rutherford.) I personally found no point at which the Watchtower was not seriously apostate and idolizing a man, or an "organization", a "Society", a "Theocracy" in place God and of Christ.

This is a journey (prove to yourself - Ro. 12:1,2), I recommend each individual undertake. This is the conclusion I came to. Not an easy pill to swallow. That's why I had to read every single book.

I found no point at which the God of Truth, nor his Son, "the truth", could have chosen the Watchtower as a "channel" or "God's organization."

I'm not telling anyone what they have to believe. I am recommending a deeper look into the history, to find the alleged point they were "faithful", only allegedly later going apostate.

goldie said:

Does God require us to belong to an earthly organization for salvation?

The Watchtower claims that belonging to the Jehovah's Witness organisation is essential for salvation. Discussion of why this is not supported Scripturally.

jwfacts.com

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Excellent article and line of reasoning. You can’t argue with any of this information for sure.

Watchman said:

You don't get it. The point is Jehovah has an organization. Jesus appointed a slave to feed his household. Some of those slaves become evil and deny the master. They become apostates. You cannot become apostate unless you at one time were faithful. Jehovah's organization has become apostate. Christ will judge the organization, not because it is not Jehovah's organization, but because it is.

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@KevinB

1 Peter 4:17 says:
“For it is the appointed time for the judgment to start with the house of God. Now if it starts first with us, what will the outcome be for those who are not obedient to the good news of God?”

Joe MacTeeg said:

Well, that brings up the crux of the matter. Rutherford was the one who coined the idea of "Jehovah's organization". And he did so claiming that Jesus "came to the temple" and "inspected" in 1919. (Malachi 3:1-3) Rutherford also claimed that since Jesus had "come with his angels", the "communication" was now coming directly from "the angels" to him. (He also said the "helper" holy spirit was no more, and not needed.)

He did away with the Watchtower magazine editorial board, claiming that "Jehovah" now communicated "directly". If one reads the alleged "spiritual food" at the time, one finds the worst books on the Bible ever written. Rutherford had "classes" for everything. (Mordecai class, Esther class, Ruth class, Naomi class, etc.) His books were complete rubbish. Embarrassing.

So, looking at the complete Watchtower history, (I personally read every Russell and Rutherford book, over 14,000 pages. Many key WT mag articles, and the first 3 books post Rutherford.) I personally found no point at which the Watchtower was not seriously apostate and idolizing a man, or an "organization", a "Society", a "Theocracy" in place God and of Christ.

This is a journey (prove to yourself - Ro. 12:1,2), I recommend each individual undertake. This is the conclusion I came to. Not an easy pill to swallow. That's why I had to read every single book.

I found no point at which the God of Truth, nor his Son, "the truth", could have chosen the Watchtower as a "channel" or "God's organization."

I'm not telling anyone what they have to believe. I am recommending a deeper look into the history, to find the alleged point they were "faithful", only allegedly later going apostate.

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Then the question remains: 'Who is the F & D steward?'

StillA_WorshiperOfJah said:

Then the question remains: 'Who is the F & D steward?'

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KevinB said:

Yup it is. But to make something plain to you since you seem sincere, l'll spell it out for you. When the GB tells anointed "domestics" that their relationship with God depends upon them and their spiritual food as the Faithful slave/ managers of God's household, they are saying that anointing and the mediation of that relationship belongs to them. They become a mediator of the new covenant instead of Christ. They put themselves in Christs place. I know because I was disfellowshipped for pointing that out. I cannot be reinstated unless I recognize the governing body as the faithful slave. So when Robert calls me delusional he is badly mistaken and just being a bully.

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I am always sincere about learning something new. It sounds to me like the GB has officially made themselves the “little popes” of the JW religion... I am sorry you were disfellowshipped! As soon as the GB definitely supported the bioweapons (update #10 of 2021), I wrote my letter demanding I no longer be counted as one of their “followers”, told them they are teaching doctrines of demons and that Jehovah‘s spirit had long left them and that their lot would be with the other Satanists of this world. So I wasn’t officially “disfellowshipped” though they probably announced otherwise behind my back...

Joe MacTeeg said:

Well, that brings up the crux of the matter. Rutherford was the one who coined the idea of "Jehovah's organization". And he did so claiming that Jesus "came to the temple" and "inspected" in 1919. (Malachi 3:1-3) Rutherford also claimed that since Jesus had "come with his angels", the "communication" was now coming directly from "the angels" to him. (He also said the "helper" holy spirit was no more, and not needed.)

He did away with the Watchtower magazine editorial board, claiming that "Jehovah" now communicated "directly". If one reads the alleged "spiritual food" at the time, one finds the worst books on the Bible ever written. Rutherford had "classes" for everything. (Mordecai class, Esther class, Ruth class, Naomi class, etc.) His books were complete rubbish. Embarrassing.

So, looking at the complete Watchtower history, (I personally read every Russell and Rutherford book, over 14,000 pages. Many key WT mag articles, and the first 3 books post Rutherford.) I personally found no point at which the Watchtower was not seriously apostate and idolizing a man, or an "organization", a "Society", a "Theocracy" in place God and of Christ.

This is a journey (prove to yourself - Ro. 12:1,2), I recommend each individual undertake. This is the conclusion I came to. Not an easy pill to swallow. That's why I had to read every single book.

I found no point at which the God of Truth, nor his Son, "the truth", could have chosen the Watchtower as a "channel" or "God's organization."

I'm not telling anyone what they have to believe. I am recommending a deeper look into the history, to find the alleged point they were "faithful", only allegedly later going apostate.

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I couldn't agree more.

I've read both of Ray Franz's books, Carl Ofof Jonnson's Gentile Times... and some others too. The proof of WT's erroneous claims is beyond dispute. Although as you say it's a tough conclusion to reach, life changing in fact although ultimately for the good.