Who is Abaddon and Apollyon?

[Carl]

Revelation 9:7-11 "And in appearance the locusts resembled horses prepared for battle; on their heads were what seemed to be crowns of gold, and their faces were like human faces, but they had hair like women’s hair. And their teeth were like those of lions, and they had breastplates like iron breastplates. And the sound of their wings was like the sound of horse-drawn chariots rushing into battle. Also, they have tails with stingers like scorpions, and in their tails is their authority to hurt the people for five months. They have over them a king, the angel of the abyss. In Hebrew his name is Abaddon, but in Greek he has the name Apollyon."

This angel is in control of the abyss as clearly stated in the above scripture. At Revelation 9:1 we read "The fifth angel blew his trumpet. And I saw a star that had fallen from heaven to the earth, and the key to the shaft of the abyss was given to him." The phrase "fallen from heaven" makes it sound like this angel is Satan, but why would Jehovah allow Satan to have control over the abyss? And who are the locusts of the abyss? Aren't they the 144,000 after they've been gathered by Jesus? At Revelation 1:17-18 we learn that Jesus has the keys to death and the grave, otherwise known as the abyss. "... And he laid his right hand on me and said: “Do not be afraid. I am the First and the Last, and the living one, and I became dead, but look! I am living forever and ever, and I have the keys of death and of the Grave." We know for sure the angel of the abyss isn't Satan after we read Revelation 20:1-3 "And I saw an angel coming down out of heaven with the key of the abyss and a great chain in his hand. He seized the dragon, the original serpent, who is the Devil and Satan, and bound him for 1,000 years. And he hurled him into the abyss..."

Since most of the world believes Abaddon/Apollyon is Satan, could there be a mass deception brewing regarding who this angel is? Is this how Satan tricks Christians into believing he is good and Jesus is bad? Does it even matter?

 

[White Stone]

Jesus has already the key when he was on earth. The demons recognized this.

Luke 8:27 “As Jesus got out onto land, a demon-possessed man from the city met him. For a considerable time he had not worn clothing, and he was staying, not in a house, but among the tombs.”​

Luke 8:31 “And they kept pleading with him not to order them to go away into the abyss.”​

After being resurrected, Jesus again says:

Matthew 28:18 “Jesus approached and spoke to them, saying: “All authority has been given me in heaven and on the earth.”​

The angel that had fallen and the angel of the abyss could be two different entities. (Note that the greek of the word “fallen” is often connected to being humiliated, disgraced or humbled)

Jesus said this regarding Satan’s fall:

Luke 10:18 “At that he said to them: “I see Satan already fallen like lightning from heaven.”​

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Which may happen when Satan was hurled down from heaven along with his angels.

Revelation 12:7-9 “And war broke out in heaven: Miʹcha·el and his angels battled with the dragon, and the dragon and its angels battled but they did not prevail, nor was a place found for them any longer in heaven. So down the great dragon was hurled, the original serpent, the one called Devil and Satan, who is misleading the entire inhabited earth; he was hurled down to the earth, and his angels were hurled down with him.”

 

[Carl]

..

 

[White Stone]

There is no exact number of locust. The locust could have been the angels punished in the time of Noah, imprisoned in Tartarus or the abyss.

Revelation 9:3 “And locusts came out of the smoke onto the earth, and authority was given to them, the same authority that the scorpions of the earth have.”​

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If you search for the word scorpions, it mentions about demons and unfaithful Israel or even the enemies of God. Most of its mention is of negative thing

 

[Carl]

The angel that had fallen and the angel of the abyss could be two different entities. (Note that the greek of the word “fallen” is often connected to being humiliated, disgraced or humbled)

The angel that has fallen is given the key to the abyss... so they must be the same. Revelation 9:1 "... And I saw a star that had fallen from heaven to the earth, and the key to the shaft of the abyss was given to him."

 

[Carl]

There is no exact number of locust.

There are 144,000 locusts

 

[Carl]

Revelation 9:3 “And locusts came out of the smoke onto the earth, and authority was given to them, the same authority that the scorpions of the earth have.”

Maybe this means the 144,000 will be given the same power the demons have had all these years? Haven't the demons been tormenting humanity? Well... the 144,000 will torment those who take the MOTB.

 

[White Stone]

The angel that has fallen is given the key to the abyss... so they must be the same.

Why was it given to him when he was fallen from heaven? Note that on Revelation 20:1-3, an angel is seen “coming down out of heaven”, denoting his coming down that is with glory. That is different with the word to one who had fallen from heaven.

There are 144,000 locusts

Can you reference a scripture saying its exact number?

Though Abbadon or Apollyon could be Jesus Christ, as what I’ve read with what KevinB shared regarding Revelation 9. Leading these hordes of locust to those who are not sealed. Just as Jehovah lead the attack of the Babylonians(referred by Joel as locust) to Judah, so also Jesus Christ will lead the locust.

 

[White Stone]

Maybe this means the 144,000 will be given the same power the demons have had all these years? Haven't the demons been tormenting humanity? Well... the 144,000 will torment those who take the MOTB.

Could be. The two witnesses were given authority to plague the earth as often as they wish during their prophesying in 42 months.(Revelation 11:6)But these locust were only given a time of 5 months and it was only to “torment” and not to kill.(Revelation 9:5)How would you reconcile this?

 

[Carl]

Why was it given to him when he was fallen from heaven? Note that on Revelation 20:1-3, an angel is seen “coming down out of heaven”, denoting his coming down that is with glory. That is different with the word to one who had fallen from heaven.

I'll be honest... the wording here (fallen) does bother me, but I don't believe Jehovah would give Satan or any demon control over the abyss. Maybe it was a mistranslation? Maybe it was supposed to read "descended" but there wasn't a good translation at the time? I also believe the locusts released are the 144,000 due to the work Robert has produced elsewhere.

 

[White Stone]

I'll be honest... the wording here (fallen) does bother me, but I don't believe Jehovah would give Satan or any demon control over the abyss. Maybe it was a mistranslation? Maybe it was supposed to read "descended" but there wasn't a good translation at the time? I also believe the locusts released are the 144,000 due to the work Robert has produced elsewhere.

I’ll be honest also, why were the locust described having many features, that is a chimera, similar with the wild beast? If you imagine this image of locust, it is not one of an appeal, but like of an abomination.


Another question. How will the 144,000, of whom many are dead, inflict torment to those who are living? Note that it is only the 5th trumpet at this time, all those sleeping will be resurrected to heaven on the 7th trumpet.

 

[SkinnyAndShort]

I wish I could join in these type of discussions, I’m just not smart enough to understand these hard topics.

 

[White Stone]

I'll be honest... the wording here (fallen) does bother me, but I don't believe Jehovah would give Satan or any demon control over the abyss.

He was only given a limited authority on the abyss, that is to open the prison of these angels. Just as Jehovah gave Satan limited authority on Job. And yet, Job’s children were not spared by Satan and allowed by Jehovah.

See that Job, who is one faithful to Jehovah, has suffered much from Satan. How much more will the wicked be?(1 Peter 4:18)

From what I can see, those worshipping idols(demons in reality; see Deu 32:16,17) will be given a chance to see how much they were loved back by their idols.

 

[Carl]

I’ll be honest also, why were the locust described having many features, that is a chimera, similar with the wild beast? If you imagine this image of locust, it is not one of an appeal, but like of an abomination.

Revelation 9:7-11 "And in appearance the locusts resembled horses prepared for battle; on their heads were what seemed to be crowns of gold, and their faces were like human faces, but they had hair like women’s hair. And their teeth were like those of lions, and they had breastplates like iron breastplates. And the sound of their wings was like the sound of horse-drawn chariots rushing into battle. Also, they have tails with stingers like scorpions, and in their tails is their authority to hurt the people for five months. They have over them a king, the angel of the abyss. In Hebrew his name is Abaddon, but in Greek he has the name Apollyon."

Robert's gone into this elsewhere, but I'll attempt to show you why I believe the locusts are the 144,000.
1. They have crowns of gold because they are kings... and we know there are only 144,000 kings and priests.
2. They have human faces because they are humans... the anointed are taken from mankind.
3. They have hair because they're the bride of Christ.
4. They have teeth of lions... maybe this is because Jesus is the lion of Judah?
5. They wear a breastplate because they are going into battle.
6. The have scorpion's tails so they can sting those who take the MOTB.

As for them being chimera the anointed won't look like this.... because this is all symbolic, not literal.

 

[Carl]

He was only given a limited authority on the abyss, that is to open the prison of these angels. Just as Jehovah gave Satan limited authority on Job. And yet, Job’s children were not spared by Satan and allowed by Jehovah

Maybe... but if the locusts are the anointed, then Satan would never have any authority over them. If they are something else, then please show me who you believe they could be.

 

[Carl]

I wish I could join in these type of discussions, I’m just not smart enough to understand these hard topics.

Don't sell yourself short! lol

 

[kirmmy]

I wish I could join in these type of discussions, I’m just not smart enough to understand these hard topics.

You and me both Brother.

 

[BagdadBill]

I wish I could join in these type of discussions, I’m just not smart enough to understand these hard topics.

I get most things but some take some digestion to work out. I've been reading the bible for 50 years and I am still learning.

 

[The God Pill]

Abbadon as Samyaza from what we know of the 2nd temple period appears the most likely possibility. Various hypotheses are always welcome as ever though.

 

[White Stone]

Maybe... but if the locusts are the anointed, then Satan would never have any authority over them. If they are something else, then please show me who you believe they could be.

Satan has no authority over the anointed except to persecute and to kill them on the great tribulation.

Regarding the locusts, they were only given authority over those who have not the seal of God. But if the torment is just figurative, symbolic, what will this mean?

Revelation 9:6 “In those days people will seek death but will by no means find it, and they will long to die, but death will flee from them.”​

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If it is to be fulfilled in literal sense. This torment could be the same illness Job suffered, that people will seek to find death for comfort. At that time, the difference between the righteous and the wicked will be plainly seen just like how Egyptians and Israelites during the 10 plagues.