Our first time speaking out and experience!

Jim

Jim

Well-known member
BARNABY THE DOG. said:
Can I ask a question on the “guilt“ issue? I ask it because judgement is definitive about guilt but there is leeway both scripturally and morally as to responsibility. We speak a good deal about watchtower and certainly, they had no right to put pressure upon the sheep about their medical decision making. Certainly their interference and motives are in a person‘s private affairs is echoed horrendously through their dealings with abuse victims within their assumed remit.

The question then is, are they aware of and were they aware beforehand, that the vaccination could be lethal? The question has some relevance if we are to assume an opinion of judgement: are they victims of their own isolation? If millions of witnesses believed that the vaccine was a “gift” of Jehovah, could this not also be the case with the deluded channel? They are blind and deaf are they not, just as much as the sheep. And were we not the same at one time? Is there really malice aforethought in this and are they deliberate in their blood guilt, or simply negligent through ignorance. Paul was off to murder the apostles was he not? I just wonder at times when I reflect on what I was like as a witness - so certain, so deceived, so ignorant as to the reality.
Click to expand...
They sowed division in the congregations. So much for the "Precious Unity" Gerrit Losch likes to repeat ad nauseum. Maybe the GB should disfellowship themselves.
 
Last edited:
W

Wide Awake

Well-known member
Jim said:
They sowed division in the congregations. So much for the "Precious Unity" Gerrit Losch likes to repeat ad nauseum regarding OUR compliance. Maybe the GB should disfellowship themselves.
Click to expand...
His GB update #7 in 2021 comparing Naaman's leprosy "cure" in the Jordan to the Vaxx as if from God was the one that helped us see the blasphemous direction being given. BTW he is not a fan of football at ALL, so maybe he had something to do with all of the carts at superbowl? Just sayin'
And having only met him once at the hall where he gave a talk, he was less than personable.
 
Jim

Jim

Well-known member
Wide Awake said:
His GB update #7 in 2021 comparing Naaman's leprosy "cure" in the Jordan to the Vaxx as if from God was the one that helped us see the blasphemous direction being given. BTW he is not a fan of football at ALL, so maybe he had something to do with all of the carts at superbowl? Just sayin'
And having only met him once at the hall where he gave a talk, he was less than personable.
Click to expand...
I almost deleted my post. It wasn't in a very good spirit. I need to get over myself. Still miffed on how I was treated for refusing to participate in this Gene Therapy Product (GTP) experiment. I was shunned by my very own parents. For TWO D*MN YEARS I couldn't see my parents. My aunt refused to see me as well. All witnesses. And my overweight, day drinking junk food eating cousin soft mocked me for not getting poked and taking vitamins instead. Never mind that I am the healthiest most health conscience person in my entire family and never got the crud that the pokey poked did! Yeah, maybe I should talk to Dr. Phil to figure out how to let it go.
 
P

Proverbs 14 v 15

Well-known member
Soul Sage said:
The pandemic caused more people to be aware (at least some of us) that this earthly organization is not perfect. Just like Israel was not perfect even though they had a big part in keeping God's word alive. There was nothing biblical about taking a genetically modified substance in your bloodstream. It's supposed to be sacred, your body is like a temple.
There was no problem with directions on staying clean. I washed my hands often. And masks don't work. That's surface level thinking to believe they do. When you actually study about masks, you find out that masks collect bacteria and dirt and many people would reuse those same masks and keep them on, they would collect bacteria on them and that could make them sick. It also handicaps your breathing in fresh air, which actually makes your immune system worse, the less fresh air you take in. Especially for hours at a time. I remember being forced to wear a mask during certain events for a few hours and I would feel worse and irritable because my body was reacting to the poor breathing I had when wearing that mask for hours.
Anyone can try this themselves in an accelerated way. Try doing intense exercises while wearing a mask and you'll later realize you feel like you might be getting sick or you feel bad internally. Well congratulations, you just made your immune system weaker. That's why I was against masks, it was obvious!
Click to expand...

Yes! My jaw dropped when Gerrit Losch, one of the GB members compared wearing masks to sneezing into a handkerchief 🤢 that was the first time I started thinking he was "losing it" 😶
BARNABY THE DOG. said:
Can I ask a question on the “guilt“ issue? I ask it because judgement is definitive about guilt but there is leeway both scripturally and morally as to responsibility. We speak a good deal about watchtower and certainly, they had no right to put pressure upon the sheep about their medical decision making. Certainly their interference and motives are in a person‘s private affairs is echoed horrendously through their dealings with abuse victims within their assumed remit.

The question then is, are they aware of and were they aware beforehand, that the vaccination could be lethal? The question has some relevance if we are to assume an opinion of judgement: are they victims of their own isolation? If millions of witnesses believed that the vaccine was a “gift” of Jehovah, could this not also be the case with the deluded channel? They are blind and deaf are they not, just as much as the sheep. And were we not the same at one time? Is there really malice aforethought in this and are they deliberate in their blood guilt, or simply negligent through ignorance. Paul was off to murder the apostles was he not? I just wonder at times when I reflect on what I was like as a witness - so certain, so deceived, so ignorant as to the reality.
Click to expand...

BARNABY THE DOG. said:
Can I ask a question on the “guilt“ issue? I ask it because judgement is definitive about guilt but there is leeway both scripturally and morally as to responsibility. We speak a good deal about watchtower and certainly, they had no right to put pressure upon the sheep about their medical decision making. Certainly their interference and motives are in a person‘s private affairs is echoed horrendously through their dealings with abuse victims within their assumed remit.

The question then is, are they aware of and were they aware beforehand, that the vaccination could be lethal? The question has some relevance if we are to assume an opinion of judgement: are they victims of their own isolation? If millions of witnesses believed that the vaccine was a “gift” of Jehovah, could this not also be the case with the deluded channel? They are blind and deaf are they not, just as much as the sheep. And were we not the same at one time? Is there really malice aforethought in this and are they deliberate in their blood guilt, or simply negligent through ignorance. Paul was off to murder the apostles was he not? I just wonder at times when I reflect on what I was like as a witness - so certain, so deceived, so ignorant as to the reality.
Click to expand...
In my experience over the past 37yrs they have been the "kings" of research, learning far more about everything and anything than a regular person. Don't forget they were associated with the UN for 10yrs too, they would have been expecting the plandemic and everything for sure. It didn't take me more than a few hours to research the injections etc
 
P

Proverbs 14 v 15

Well-known member
Wide Awake said:
His GB update #7 in 2021 comparing Naaman's leprosy "cure" in the Jordan to the Vaxx as if from God was the one that helped us see the blasphemous direction being given. BTW he is not a fan of football at ALL, so maybe he had something to do with all of the carts at superbowl? Just sayin'
And having only met him once at the hall where he gave a talk, he was less than personable.
Click to expand...

And he compared wearing a mask to sneezing into a handkerchief 🤢 mad!!
 
Citrine

Citrine

Well-known member
Proverbs 14 v 15 said:
Yes! My jaw dropped when Gerrit Losch, one of the GB members compared wearing masks to sneezing into a handkerchief 🤢 that was the first time I started thinking he was "losing it" 😶


In my experience over the past 37yrs they have been the "kings" of research, learning far more about everything and anything than a regular person. Don't forget they were associated with the UN for 10yrs too, they would have been expecting the plandemic and everything for sure. It didn't take me more than a few hours to research the injections etc
Click to expand...
In my experience over the past 37yrs they have been the "kings" of research, learning far more about everything and anything than a regular person.

This 👆right here! They made a point in a previous broadcast to brag about how they spent two years researching the accuracy of a Roman guards belt buckle for an article. TWO YEARS ON A G.D. BELT BUCKLE! Then they suddenly can’t research the safety of the openly experimental vx before they push it on 8 million followers! I’m sorry they don’t get a pass, no excuses, they are guilty!
 
P

Proverbs 14 v 15

Well-known member
StopTheInsanity said:
For you and anyone else who needs to hear this: Jehovah is going to heal ALL of the injured, bind up the broken hearted, and resurrect all those who died.

The only "good" that can come from this is that at least they died and won't have to go through the "fun" that awaits the rest of us. :rolleyes:

We are the "300 men" that are left with Gideon. Jehovah has seen something in all of us that he knows he can work with: be it faith, discernment, whatever.

But, as painful as this all has been, it WILL be made right again and we WILL be smiling and light-hearted again. We MUST believe that. If nothing else, don't ever let these scoundrels take your faith. Jehovah didn't do this; wicked and decietful men did this and as always, Jehovah warned us that about them and Christ told us that there would be wolves in sheeps clothing and that people would be stumbled and that people would betray us but we didn't fully understand because WT didn't explain it to us because WT WAS GOING TO BE THE ONE TO DO IT TO US so why would they warn us????

The apostles didn't fully understand everything about how and why Christ was going to die, and they were stumbled, but after his resurrection, they understood all things and were BOLD for Jehovah.

So here we all are.
Click to expand...
Thankyou for those words, they made me feel so much better, everything you said is so right..
 
P

Proverbs 14 v 15

Well-known member
Soul Sage said:
Yes, great bible application. The 300 men were chosen because even if they were part of the army of Gideon as their leader, they were still very cautious about their surroundings. They didn't let their guard down when drinking water just cause Gideon was anointed over them. Same can be said about the GB. I don't let my guard down just because the GB may say so. I still stay cautious.
Click to expand...
Yes, Jesus said to Keep on the Watch, and the GB did not do that at all..
 
P

Proverbs 14 v 15

Well-known member
Citrine said:
In my experience over the past 37yrs they have been the "kings" of research, learning far more about everything and anything than a regular person.

This 👆right here! They made a point in a previous broadcast to brag about how they spent two years researching the accuracy of a Roman guards belt buckle for an article. TWO YEARS ON A G.D. BELT BUCKLE! Then they suddenly can’t research the safety of the openly experimental vx before they push it on 8 million followers! I’m sorry they don’t get a pass, no excuses, they are guilty!
Click to expand...
EXACTLY!! I've never been able to understand people who say that they made a mistake, or they didn't know, nothing at all makes sense if you give them those excuses.
 
jay

jay

Well-known member
BARNABY THE DOG. said:
Can I ask a question on the “guilt“ issue? I ask it because judgement is definitive about guilt but there is leeway both scripturally and morally as to responsibility. We speak a good deal about watchtower and certainly, they had no right to put pressure upon the sheep about their medical decision making. Certainly their interference and motives are in a person‘s private affairs is echoed horrendously through their dealings with abuse victims within their assumed remit.

The question then is, are they aware of and were they aware beforehand, that the vaccination could be lethal? The question has some relevance if we are to assume an opinion of judgement: are they victims of their own isolation? If millions of witnesses believed that the vaccine was a “gift” of Jehovah, could this not also be the case with the deluded channel? They are blind and deaf are they not, just as much as the sheep. And were we not the same at one time? Is there really malice aforethought in this and are they deliberate in their blood guilt, or simply negligent through ignorance. Paul was off to murder the apostles was he not? I just wonder at times when I reflect on what I was like as a witness - so certain, so deceived, so ignorant as to the reality.
Click to expand...
Didn't the wt for years speak out against vaccines? With their involvement with the UN and other Medical Orgs. they may have had incite from the get go on the damages of this fake vaccine. Plus the money offered for all of those that took the shot. I feel that under the direction of satan they well knew what this poison was going to do to the sheep.
 
Medi-tator

Medi-tator

Well-known member
Ana said:
No dudéis en avisar si volvéis a sus playas, vivimos en ellas. Por desgracia ya nada de lo que podamos ver nos sorprende, en el declive hay montañas rusas para unos, pasajes del terror para otros, algunos terminan muy golpeados de los autos de choque...y aún queda la gran explosión cuando bajen todos desde el cielo a la fiesta maligna. Vamos a coger fuerzas aunque sea un poco de tiempo antes de eso. No falta mucho y nos vendrá a todos bien saber que compartimos una fe renovada, de la que más adelante seremos testigos con más plenitud Aguante queridos!!
Click to expand...
Here is footage of your former home @Ana. This just happened there a week or so ago.

 
A

A B

Well-known member
BARNABY THE DOG. said:
Can I ask a question on the “guilt“ issue? I ask it because judgement is definitive about guilt but there is leeway both scripturally and morally as to responsibility. We speak a good deal about watchtower and certainly, they had no right to put pressure upon the sheep about their medical decision making. Certainly their interference and motives are in a person‘s private affairs is echoed horrendously through their dealings with abuse victims within their assumed remit.

The question then is, are they aware of and were they aware beforehand, that the vaccination could be lethal? The question has some relevance if we are to assume an opinion of judgement: are they victims of their own isolation? If millions of witnesses believed that the vaccine was a “gift” of Jehovah, could this not also be the case with the deluded channel? They are blind and deaf are they not, just as much as the sheep. And were we not the same at one time? Is there really malice aforethought in this and are they deliberate in their blood guilt, or simply negligent through ignorance. Paul was off to murder the apostles was he not? I just wonder at times when I reflect on what I was like as a witness - so certain, so deceived, so ignorant as to the reality.
Click to expand...
There was an update, I forget which one, probably around June or July of 21 where they very somberly reported the death #s and how many were/were not vaccinated. That was after there was time enough for the high risk groups to get vaccinated. I give them a pass then, I think those numbers would be very convincing to them and as they said they were collected by brothers so they felt there was integrity in those statistics. I think they were doing the best they could and knowing that people were looking to them for advice/guidance.

IMHO...what started out as what looked like sound advice...they got so cocksure of it took on a weird flavor. Jehovah is not going to concern himself with doctrinal or organizational matters or even cancer treatment but will suddenly get involved in this? It made my head hurt. And it was weird the way people lapped it up. I remember being in zoom service a few days after Splane's update and someone inserted into the conversation, "What does Jehovah know!" mimicking that Jehovah is answering the question for us.

I maintain that the initial vaccinations may have been an evident course of action for many groups of people. I never liked how there was no emphasis on the alternative therapies or preventions but I understand that would have killed the emergency use authorization if there was anything else that might have worked. I think that conflict of interest poisons the water. It was wrong for everyone to say you are saving grandma by getting vaccinated when there was no data to support if that was true or not. The pushing of the vaccine on young healthy people with low risk seemed questionable, even at the time.
 
J

Jeremiah17:5

Well-known member
Wide Awake said:
We are a married couple who have been lurking on here for a couple of years. We are fortunate enough to both have woken up together. It has been a process and are still somewhat in due to caretaking for elderly parents. One seems to be PIMQ giving us hope. We have a lot to say but for now will keep it to an overview. This is the first online platform or outside online forum we discovered and really helped open our eyes.

We are thankful to Robert for having created this space for us to have a place to finally speak.

This is the first time we are speaking out. We have wanted to for a while and finally allowing ourselves to do so. Everyone has their reasons and pace and we will not encourage anyone to go any particular route. Everyone has to go at their own pace for their own reasons and if there is anything we have learned now it is not to judge others and to show more love. We were die hard pimi’s. We both have had “special privileges/titles” for many decades.

There are things we have read on some posts and we can answer some questions.

What woke us up? VAXX pressure. The absolute insanity and pressure to encourage people to take the VAXX which is a personal medical decision was beyond distressing. We do not say that lightly. The ENORMOUS pressure and HORRIBLE statements it allowed the “brothers and sisters” to say were beyond hurtful and unloving. In time, hopefully we can explain more, but for now know we are still seeing double talk. This weekend’s current one-day program with the branch representative literally said “…with health issues , how sad it was to see that even simple matters of public health such as wearing masks or hand washing or physical distancing or vaxxs, those things became controversial , even political, but those are all things Jehovah has given us direction on.” Yet a few days ago they just put out a letter saying they no longer require VAXX for theocratic schools. The requirements for those in special service were extremely strong. We could write a novel on this subject, but not now. We knew something was seriously wrong and this allowed us to give ourselves permission to research other things. We believe that if it is truth, it should be able to withstand scrutiny. The ARC was especially powerful. One of us has had this experience personally and believed it was a rare or not a common occurrence. Well, one of us sat and watched the whole thing straight with tears, hurt and anger and the other saw enough to know this is not Jehovah’s direction and knew what their spouse had been through. The husband stepped away from his position and would love to have unloaded but couldn’t. We also downloaded the court documents from the ARC. We are forever grateful to the ARC and even Geoffrey Jackson for showing who he really is as well as where the GB and WT stands.

The ARC led to the rabbit hole and while trying to fade finally during a zoom one of us stood up (after a ridiculous comment by an elder who has to talk about the VAXX still), and said I can’t do this anymore! So, in our own way though already we had started slowly fading for a year (at a snails pace), we stepped it up and though still connected we are hanging in barely for our parents and cannot fully detach at this time. You will understand later and it KILLS us to feel like we are living a double life. We still love God and believe Jesus is our mediator! Yes, we didn’t even realize the GB had taken that upon themselves. We need an outlet to speak more freely and with those who still have faith, though we do not judge anyone who has lost theirs. Its amazing anyone still has any faith after all we have seen. So, we believe each person can choose their own path as we want to walk on our own path. It has been a difficult, painful process, but we are in a better place now. We need friends with whom we can communicate freely. There are things we appreciate as JWs brought us to each other and helped us with other things, but this org is not directed by Jehovah in our opinion. As Jesus said: “You will recognize them by their fruits.” We have been reading the bible without the WT lens and are enjoying it.

Additional comments:
  • Regarding cart witnessing- actually, yes it has been effective in some areas and that is why they are doing it. We personally started studies, Rv’s and know of many who returned to the org from it.
  • Cart Crashing- you can do what you want but know it just re-reinforces in their minds persecution for the sake of Jah and they shut down their minds. Maybe ask a simple question and do not act like you know more than them as you know they think they know everything and honestly, we use to be those people.
  • Hawaii dress code: yes, last fall they allowed for Brothers to wear Aloha shirts even during conventions due to the “culture”. Instructed not to post on social media.
  • We are constantly reminding ourselves we were those people and to have grace as we know ones who are questioning, but don’t know if they will ever do anything about it. We are trying to be compassionate to the R&F as so many just don’t know. We have both been baptized between 30—40 yrs
  • They are reaching out to see where people stand and following up on inactive ones. We are preparing ourselves.
Thank you for bearing with this introduction and in the future will try to keep comments shorter. We have a lot bottled up inside and are keeping our identities and location private for now. Again, thank you for letting us be here. Side note…we have spent time on this site plenty of times while in service and meetings to keep sane! You all are so brave and courageous! We are fully aware we are blessed to at least have each other to talk about these matters. We love you all!
Click to expand...
Welcome!! So many of us have the same exact point of waking up to the Org... My story is just like yours... However... I have not been able to fully explain to my wife exactly how I feel and my thoughts... My wife has high Anxiety as it is... She's dealing with emotional family trauma... her own Sexual abuse trauma...younger kids... moving...The stresses of Life... I really don't want to add to her plate of things to deal with...but I'm also finding it more and more difficult to ..."promote the Org"...speak or mention anything positive about the GB, encourage my kids to "reach out", Study the WT...Etc...

I've been baptized for 30 years myself and am currently a MS... My wife can read me like a book though...she has to be aware i'm not as enthusiastic about the Org... so I'm about at the point I have to talk to her about everything that's wrong with the Org...I've just been waiting til more came out negative about the vaccines (mainstream) ...Til the works in the Earth were "exposed more" ... I've been moving very slowly ...and not rushing to any decisions... and trying to make sure I'm on Jehovah's side and that Christ is my King and who I follow... I can get out of the boat and follow Jesus... Just not sure my wife is ready yet...I have to continue to pray for direction..
Glad to have you here!!
 
Melinda

Melinda

Well-known member
Jeremiah17:5 said:
Welcome!! So many of us have the same exact point of waking up to the Org... My story is just like yours... However... I have not been able to fully explain to my wife exactly how I feel and my thoughts... My wife has high Anxiety as it is... She's dealing with emotional family trauma... her own Sexual abuse trauma...younger kids... moving...The stresses of Life... I really don't want to add to her plate of things to deal with...but I'm also finding it more and more difficult to ..."promote the Org"...speak or mention anything positive about the GB, encourage my kids to "reach out", Study the WT...Etc...

I've been baptized for 30 years myself and am currently a MS... My wife can read me like a book though...she has to be aware i'm not as enthusiastic about the Org... so I'm about at the point I have to talk to her about everything that's wrong with the Org...I've just been waiting til more came out negative about the vaccines (mainstream) ...Til the works in the Earth were "exposed more" ... I've been moving very slowly ...and not rushing to any decisions... and trying to make sure I'm on Jehovah's side and that Christ is my King and who I follow... I can get out of the boat and follow Jesus... Just not sure my wife is ready yet...I have to continue to pray for direction..
Glad to have you here!!
Click to expand...
If I could make a suggestion when the time comes when you feel it’s the time to tell your wife. I would start the conversation out with something like this…There is nothing in this world that will break my faith and my love for Jehovah and his son in fact my faith has only became stronger etc …. By reassuring her and of your faith before you shake her world you will put her at ease from the beginning… just a suggestion
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top