Unless those days were cut short no flesh would be saved

DR74minus

Well-known member
I would love for someone to post the order of events

1 The Christ comes into his Kingdom, 2, Those asleep in Christ are resurrected, 3, Satan Gets kicked out of heaven, 4, the cry for peace 5, 7th head gets the sword stroke, ( speculation according to Satan;s order ) triggering, 6, G/T and WW3, the preaching of the good news comes to a halt, the W/T reaches it's use by date, 7, G/T is cut short for the purpose of sealing the remnant 8, the 2 witnesses finish their assignment and are eventually killed by the wild beast, 9, chosen gain access to heaven , 10, Jesus destroys Satan's system at Armageddon 11, Christ locks Satan up.

Thats the gist of my story right or wrong. Feel free to come up with your own. Have not made up my mind if 2 and 3 are in the right order.
 
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J

Jehovahsloyalchild

Guest
I don't know if I'd call it a break for some people. It's really the beginning of a new phase in God's plan. It is in this period of time when people will finally come to know they are either with God or doomed.

1 The Christ comes into his Kingdom, 2, Those asleep in Christ are resurrected, 3, Satan Gets kicked out of heaven, 4, the cry for peace 5, 7th head gets the sword stroke, ( speculation according to Satan;s order ) triggering, 6, G/T and WW3, the preaching of the good news comes to a halt, the W/T reaches it's use by date, 7, G/T is cut short for the purpose of sealing the remnant 8, the 2 witnesses finish their assignment and are eventually killed by the wild beast, 9, chosen gain access to heaven , 10, Jesus destroys Satan's system at Armageddon 11, Christ locks Satan up.

Thats the gist of my story right or wrong. Feel free to come up with your own. Have not made up my mind if 2 and 3 are in the right order.
1. Matthew 24 beginning pangs of distress(present day) 2. Cry of peace 3. GT 4th seal of Revelation 3. 5th seal opens during GT Those anointed dead in Christ are ressurected. 4. 6th Seal 7th head gets the swordstroke Satan is evicted thrown out. 5. Christ Kingdom begins ruling Harvesting begins 6. Rise of the 8th king NWO 7. 42 month prophesying period just prior to the Opening of the 7th Seal and the beginning of the trumpet blasts and God's bowls wrath His Judgments. 8. Armegeddon.

That's my take anyway 🤷‍♀️
 

Ms_ladyblue

Well-known member
My dedication and baptism was April 4, 1982 unfortunately...I think I was more dedicated to the organization at the time. Every day I am in awe of Jehovah's love and patience.
I just don’t remember my teacher putting so much emphasis on the organization when I was studying. Even at the meetings I don’t remember hearing about any undue emphasis being put on the organization. I guess I was oblivious for a time.
The first impression I got that Jehovah was using this organization was when I read the brochure, The Government That Will Bring Paradise. It explains from the beginning a timeline of the events, in simple language, how Jehovah used his faithful servants who were led and then the nation of Israel was formed and how the seed would come through the line of Judah…and that would be the Messiah.

So, in my mind I thought of those faithful ones like Abraham, Jacob, Joseph, Moses and the prophets and more important, Jesus who were faithful servants of Jehovah so I would try to focus more on the faith they showed.
As far as the WT was concerned, I understood when they gave us direction in line with the Bible it wasn’t a problem for me…but I have to admit if the direction they gave us at times seemed inconsistent with Jehovah or Jesus‘ thinking, let’s just say I would be half hearted about following direction. But I was being half hearted to the organization not to Jehovah.
 
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Jahrule

Well-known member
I just don’t remember my teacher putting so much emphasis on the organization when I was studying. Even at the meetings I don’t remember hearing about any undue emphasis being put on the organization. I guess I was oblivious for a time.
The first impression I got that Jehovah was using this organization was when I read the brochure, The Government That Will Bring Paradise. It explains from the beginning a timeline of the events, in simple language, how Jehovah used his faithful servants who were led and then the nation of Israel was formed and how the seed would come through the line of Judah…and that would be the Messiah.

So, in my mind I thought of those faithful ones like Abraham, Jacob, Joseph, Moses and the prophets and more important, Jesus who were faithful servants of Jehovah so I would try to focus more on the faith they showed.
As far as the WT was concerned, I understood when they gave us direction in line with the Bible it wasn’t a problem for me…but I have to admit if the direction they gave us at times seemed inconsistent with Jehovah or Jesus‘ thinking, let’s just say I would be half hearted about following direction. But I was being half hearted to the organization not to Jehovah.
I didn't notice it until much later either. It may be that it was always there we just weren't ready to be unplugged yet.
 

DR74minus

Well-known member
I didn't notice it until much later either. It may be that it was always there we just weren't ready to be unplugged yet.
I suspect it might have been mentioned in the cong, because I distinctly had in my mind that there were 2 orgs Jehovah's and Satan's. I have had that thinking since before I was baptized in 83. Apparently Rutherford used the expression in one his books, but I never read any of them, so I'm thinking some in the cong have read the book/s and they probably said it at different times prehaps. The expression has been part of my thinking for a long time.
 
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PJ54

Well-known member
Curious to know how you define "Christ's Kingdom arrives" ?
Consider these verses:
(Matthew 24:32, 33) 32 “Now learn this illustration from the fig tree: Just as soon as its young branch grows tender and sprouts its leaves, you know that summer is near. 33 Likewise also you, when you see all these things, know that he is near at the doors.

(Revelation 3:20) 20 Look! I am standing at the door and knocking. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come into his house and take the evening meal with him and he with me.
 

evw

Well-known member
Nope. The eighth king is post-tribulation. If you notice, whenever the WT claims that the tribulation begins when the beast turns upon the harlot they might cite a verse in Revelation but it never supports their assertion that it is the tribulation.
Sorry, but I'm just trying to get my brain in this 'post WT direction'. So if I understand it correctly, are the ones that are mentioned in Rev. 7:14 'So right away I said to him: “My lord, you are the one who knows.” And he said to me: “These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb' are NOT the great crowd, what the WT teaches, but the anoited?
 

Jahrule

Well-known member
Sorry, but I'm just trying to get my brain in this 'post WT direction'. So if I understand it correctly, are the ones that are mentioned in Rev. 7:14 'So right away I said to him: “My lord, you are the one who knows.” And he said to me: “These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb' are NOT the great crowd, what the WT teaches, but the anoited?
Both groups come out of tribulation. The anointed just have a special assignment. Coming out of the tribulation is the key issue because if you don't come out of the tribulation on Jah's side you are doomed, regardless of which hope you have.
 

SusanB

Well-known member
Sorry, but I'm just trying to get my brain in this 'post WT direction'. So if I understand it correctly, are the ones that are mentioned in Rev. 7:14 'So right away I said to him: “My lord, you are the one who knows.” And he said to me: “These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb' are NOT the great crowd, what the WT teaches, but the anoited?
They are the Great Crowd.

Revelation 7 starts with the sealing of the anointed and the symbolic tribes. Then verse 9 starts with ”After this” meaning after the anointed are sealed.

Revelation 7:9-17: “After this I saw, and look! a great crowd, which no man was able to number, out of all nations and tribes and peoples and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, dressed in white robes; and there were palm branches in their hands. And they keep shouting with a loud voice, saying: “Salvation we owe to our God, who is seated on the throne, and to the Lamb.” All the angels were standing around the throne and the elders and the four living creatures, and they fell facedown before the throne and worshipped God, saying: “Amen! Let the praise and the glory and the wisdom and the thanksgiving and the honor and the power and the strength be to our God forever and ever. Amen.” In response one of the elders said to me: “These who are dressed in the white robes, who are they and where did they come from?” So right away I said to him: “My lord, you are the one who knows.” And he said to me: “These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. That is why they are before the throne of God, and they are rendering him sacred service day and night in his temple; and the One seated on the throne will spread his tent over them. They will hunger no more nor thirst anymore, neither will the sun beat down on them nor any scorching heat, because the Lamb, who is in the midst* of the throne, will shepherd themt and will guide them to springs* of waters of life. And God will wipe out every tear from their eyes.”

So, I could be wrong but the way I am understanding this is more than just the Great Crowd come out of the Great Tribulation but the Great Crowd are the ones who after coming out of the Great Tribulation choose Kingdom Rulership. There are wicked who will also come out of the Great Tribulation but they won’t be submitting to Kingdom rulership.
 

evw

Well-known member
I’m guessing that towards the end of that period it will turn into a pronouncement of judgment for 5 months.
Could that be the period comparable to the time of Noah when the door of the ark was closed and it took another 7 days before it started to rain and it was therefore too late to 'repent'?
 

SusanB

Well-known member
Could that be the period comparable to the time of Noah when the door of the ark was closed and it took another 7 days before it started to rain and it was therefore too late to 'repent'?
Good question. Something to consider.
 

evw

Well-known member
They are the Great Crowd.

Revelation 7 starts with the sealing of the anointed and the symbolic tribes. Then verse 9 starts with ”After this” meaning after the anointed are sealed.

Revelation 7:9-17: “After this I saw, and look! a great crowd, which no man was able to number, out of all nations and tribes and peoples and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, dressed in white robes; and there were palm branches in their hands. And they keep shouting with a loud voice, saying: “Salvation we owe to our God, who is seated on the throne, and to the Lamb.” All the angels were standing around the throne and the elders and the four living creatures, and they fell facedown before the throne and worshipped God, saying: “Amen! Let the praise and the glory and the wisdom and the thanksgiving and the honor and the power and the strength be to our God forever and ever. Amen.” In response one of the elders said to me: “These who are dressed in the white robes, who are they and where did they come from?” So right away I said to him: “My lord, you are the one who knows.” And he said to me: “These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. That is why they are before the throne of God, and they are rendering him sacred service day and night in his temple; and the One seated on the throne will spread his tent over them. They will hunger no more nor thirst anymore, neither will the sun beat down on them nor any scorching heat, because the Lamb, who is in the midst* of the throne, will shepherd themt and will guide them to springs* of waters of life. And God will wipe out every tear from their eyes.”

So, I could be wrong but the way I am understanding this is more than just the Great Crowd come out of the Great Tribulation but the Great Crowd are the ones who after coming out of the Great Tribulation choose Kingdom Rulership. There are wicked who will also come out of the Great Tribulation but they won’t be submitting to Kingdom rulership.
YES! of course thank you; I forgot the beginning of chapter 7 (stupid me)
 

evw

Well-known member
Good question. I am wondering too. Also, could it be just before Armageddon after the 8th King kills the chosen ones.
Paul says in 1 Thessalonians 5 v 3 Whenever they say, "Peace and security!" then sudden annihilation will strike them at once, just as labor pains in a pregnant woman, and they will by no means escape it.
Could that be if the anointed are killed, the 8th king (read Satan) has a 'sense of superiority' and thinks he has won?
 
G

gitane

Guest
Could that be if the anointed are killed, the 8th king (read Satan) has a 'sense of superiority' and thinks he has won?
The context of the end of preceding chapter is about the time when Lord calls those who died in union in him back to life. Seems like Paul is tying it to that?
 

SusanB

Well-known member
Paul says in 1 Thessalonians 5 v 3 Whenever they say, "Peace and security!" then sudden annihilation will strike them at once, just as labor pains in a pregnant woman, and they will by no means escape it.
Could that be if the anointed are killed, the 8th king (read Satan) has a 'sense of superiority' and thinks he has won?
I am not sure.
 
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